Speaker 0: Sierra has all the best active and outdoor brands for the super athletic stuff, like running gear for cruising up the trail. Whoo. And the super athletic ish stuff, like fishing gear for chilling by the creek. Nice cast. Fitness apparel to push for higher reps. You got this. And golf balls priced so you could afford to lose one. Or a few. Head to Sierra or sierra.com for the brands you want at the prices that let you do it all. From athletic to athletic, Sierra's got it.

Speaker 1: Pros trust The Home Depot for heavy duty storage solutions for any job site or garage. Right now, get up to 15% off select storage and organization, impact and water resistant totes, and shelving built to hold up to 2,500 pounds. Storage systems have space for all your tools and protect them in the garage, on the job site, and everywhere in between. Save time and maximize efficiency with adjustable shelving customized to your business's needs. Shop and save on pro grade storage at the Home Depot. How pros get more done.

Speaker 2: It's game time on the field and your time to shoot for 1,000,000. With Spin and Gold, a $5 buy in puts you right into the action. Get ready for lightning fast poker with just two rivals to beat. And if the spinner lands on the 200,000 multiplier, you could be playing for the $1,000,000 top prize. New players even get two free shots to score that game changing $1,000,000 Play with your FanDuel account or sign up today. Gambling problem? Call 1800. 21 in present Michigan, New Jersey, or Pennsylvania for bonus ticket offer login and claim tickets. Tickets expire seven days from date issue. Restrictions apply.

Speaker 3: Athletic Brewing Company crafts award winning nonalcoholic beers for those who wanna be part of every round. With over 185 flavor awards. They're exceptional NA beers that fit your lifestyle and any social occasion. Summer's full of good times and athletic fits right in. Go to athleticbrewing.com to have brews delivered to your door or find them at a bar restaurant or store near you. Nearbyer, athletic brewing company fit for all times.

Speaker 4: Hey. Heidey hole lions fans. Welcome to the Detroit Lions podcast. This is episode 607. It's getting up there. The NFL pre draft Detroit Lions roundtable. I think it has all the keywords we want. This is your official Detroit Lions podcast for Reddit. I am your Dashing Insta host, Chris. And with me are the most wonderful humans of the week, Russell Brown, Russ Brown, and Michael Gray. How are you guys doing today?

Speaker 5: It sounds like the DLP is brought to you by SEO.

Speaker 4: Somebody's gotta do it, Frank. Somebody's gotta do it.

Speaker 6: Yeah. There's the show of colors here. Brown and gray were here. So, no. Happy to be here. Glad we're we're talking some football.

Speaker 4: I'm the token white. Okay. Let's let's get through. We're gonna talk football. We are thinking of doing a, a little bit of a chat, about the draft. I think we're we're planning early next week to do a roundtable with a lot of us to kinda do an actual mock draft, and it's it's a really, really nice setup. I think you guys are gonna love what we do. We were talking about doing it tonight, but it's a it's a Chris failure. So we will we will get you early early next week, and and get chatting about all this stuff. Okay. So there's a lot a lot going on, a lot breaking in the world of draft and Detroit Lions. First of all, Russ, I know you and you and Bish just did a podcast that came out came out this morning. You did it yesterday. What's changed in the day? Are we now drafting, a tight end first?

Speaker 6: We are not drafting a tight end first. I mean, I would be absolutely shocked if that was the case. I mean, I guess anything is possible. But, no, not much has really changed, unless you wanna talk about some of the comments of Alex Anzalone talking with Jordan Chris, how he was going to be, you know, coming back. That's what Dan Campbell wanted, but ownership and management in the front office felt otherwise. But, overall, draft wise, there hasn't been really nothing new. I mean, a lot of the tea leaves here are pointing to, of course, Caden Procter as Scott and I talked about. But, it's a guessing game because it sounds like as much as they lean towards maybe offensive tackle, Matt Miller of espn.com is going out there saying they equally are looking at at defensive end and and a pass rusher. So, I think that that's probably the expectation two weeks from now. Pick seventeen and fifty, offensive tackle, pass rusher, and proceed from there.

Speaker 4: Yeah. Yeah. Rerun, that was that that that lead in there was for you. So, Gray, what's your big argument for, a tight end in the first round?

Speaker 5: Yeah. You know, one of the interesting things I do with the kids in the slack, just rather than get real granular on the mod graphs because that Russ and Jeff are already doing that stuff at the Jedi level. I'd just be all films. It is interesting to me to watch kind of a consensus, and you go into, you know, like mock draft database and just grab the 10 most recently updated mocks. Today was the first day where when I grabbed that, all 10 were offensive tackles. Now there were there were four of them that were proctored. There were two for Fanu, two for Lomo, Freeling was in there, and, there's some there's another one I'm forgetting about. Vanga, I think. And it was all it it's been heading that way as you do these consensi what's plural for consensuses? Consentin? I don't know what that is. Consensual. Yeah. Careful. It's been, it's been leaning that way. And today was the first time where just a random sampling of 10 mocks all had the lions taking a tackle because at that 17 spot, it's the I mean, I hate to say it. It's the only thing that makes sense. I don't know that there's going to be the edge worth that pick there. You hope one falls to 50 or one's trade worthy. You can go up and get it or you can fall back and get it. But at 17, if they pick in that spot, and, you know, that's all we can go on right now, it kinda looks like that, you know, the the needs meet the talent pool, meets the pick, and you get your tackle.

Speaker 4: You know, it's funny because I'm I'm looking at the big board, the consensus, and it's it's almost over 90 different draft by big names, people who've been rather relatively trustworthy. The consensus at 17 is a tight end. But now that's just the ranking. Right? The this this is just the ranking of players, not who the Lions are gonna take.

Speaker 5: But

Speaker 4: I I I won't I won't harp on that for too long. But, I do wanna say, hey. Check out the, the big board at detroitlionspodcast.com. We got a great big board of of all the consensus picks and updates every day with who of with all the different things, amalgamate, some or averages, and we'll put them up there. Detroitlionspodcast.com. Check it out. It's in the menu, big draft board. That being said, also there, mister Rizden has a a really good article today that he wrote, all about, the a quarterback prospect for every single round. I don't think we'll do quarterback first round, but,

Speaker 6: you know, I don't see that

Speaker 4: at all. It always feels like you need another cornerback, doesn't it?

Speaker 5: Well, I mean, there's seven or eight of them on IR at the end of every season over the last couple of years. So, yeah, you could have, a couple dozen of them, and it doesn't feel like it would be enough.

Speaker 6: Yeah. And at at the same time, like, with how they've constructed the roster, that's that's a very, heavy room right now with a lot of talent as far as first round picks, one year deals. You go go through the list. I mean, there's a ton of guys in that room. So I don't know if, like, they're doing that to maybe buy Ennis Rakestra potentially some time. Let's see what he's got, before we say, hey. It's a bust, but, he's gotta obviously stay healthy. But I I would just be so stunned if, like, they went out and got Avion Terrell or Jermott McCoy. And I think Jermott McCoy is gonna be gone by 17 anyways. So I wouldn't if, like, you if you're doing mock drafts out there, I don't know if I would necessarily keep putting him there. Like, you're in the the mindset of we're gonna draft the corner because I think he might be the first defensive back off the board when it's when it's all said in two weeks.

Speaker 4: Yes. Yes. And, I mean, frankly, I want the very, very best out of Raikstra. I want him to get his chance to prove his medal, but at minimum, I want him to at least become trade bait so we can get something for him at this point. I mean, because the the bust the bust word is just it's too much capital gone, and it's the the fear. And it's I got the fear in on that one. So, right. So what do you what do you guys think about, is this his year? Is he gonna is he gonna emerge, or the injury is just gonna stay with and, cause us the consternation that we felt already so far?

Speaker 5: Well, I hate to start talking about, curses or trend lines, but outside of the year when Laporta and Branch got picked up, and, of course, Branch is hurt as well, the second round has been a nightmare. Right? You have Levi, you have Pascal, you have Raikstra, and they follow a very an eerily similar pattern of being unavailable and being hurt, and then eventually, you know, they just kind of Thanos snaps and they turn into dust and out of town.

Speaker 4: Under that make?

Speaker 5: You hope you hope nothing like that happens with Raikstra, and and that he can go out there and at least contribute depth, and give you give you a piece, something to work with. I know social media with, he and Terry on Arnold, who's also had fun off season. You know, they've been they're talking the game like they're gonna be there and they're gonna be ready and they're gonna be they're gonna be all on top of it. And, obviously, that's a best case scenario. I don't know. I can't bet on it. I mean Yeah. You just you you can't possibly think, well, this will be the year based on anything other than vibes because he's giving you nothing to believe in to this point.

Speaker 4: So based on his college work, Russ, because no one's seen him play in the pros. What do you I mean, what what do we have as far as quality? If this guy stays healthy, is he going to be worthy of his pick if he's healthy for the rest of his career with the Lions?

Speaker 6: Yeah. I mean, you would hope so. I mean, I I think he can definitely be that. I mean, oddly enough, his pro comparison and for people out there that obviously watch the the Bishop Brown show, like, I'm not a big pro comp guy, and I don't believe in giving that to players very often. But it's a lot of the time, like, feel and how they play and styles and things like that. And I just every time I watched him, I was like, man, I kinda feel like I'm watching Emmanuel Mosley. And then sure enough, he can't stay healthy like Emmanuel Mosley. But, you know, he's a long corner. He's fluid. He's gonna be able to win in press man. He's got the ability to turn and run and open his hips. So all is good there with his athleticism, but I just I don't know if he's gonna be available. I mean, the injury listing that he had coming into the NFL was already long, and he's just been adding to it. So I hope he's ready to go. I hope he's a guy that we can count on, and you can get him on the field for depth purposes or special teams because it was killing me late in the season watching Jack Campbell run down on kickoff and then have to go out and play defense every snap. And it's just like, that's how guys get hurt, and that's what changes the trajectory of their career. And that's a guy that we all know. Like, the eggs are in the basket there. Like, we're full in. That's our guys. So let's hope these guys are staying healthy and doing the right thing so they're available so everybody can kinda get a little bit of piece of the pie here.

Speaker 4: Awesome. Jeff Merrill out here in the Slack or in the chat is, he's also in the Slack too. But he's keeping the presser question alive, helping us mock the, the press questions in the post games. This one's for you specifically, Russ. I may, embellish it a little bit, but, do you feel your purple background is inspired by purple rain and the assless chaps that prince wore or purple haze and choking on your own vomit?

Speaker 6: We'll we'll go we'll go with the purple rain on that. I mean, I could do a different color if people prefer a different color. You want blue? You want, we'll do green. I just need to add

Speaker 4: not green. But blue's kinda hard too. Blue's probably the best the safest one to go with because Blue? The lines. Alright. That's fine. That's Alright.

Speaker 6: I I don't know. Just sometimes, the light that I have in this room, I have, like, a small office here, like, a little I don't know, eight by eight room or whatever it is, and the light is right above my head. So, like, certain hats I wear, it looks horrible. And I'm just like, let me just dim everything and put on these lights.

Speaker 4: So that's

Speaker 6: what we've been doing lately.

Speaker 5: I didn't realize Russ was broadcasting from a German disc attack. That's awesome.

Speaker 6: We're all over the place here. Nation nationwide, baby.

Speaker 4: Well, he is wearing the ass assless chaps, so he would go right in in that German disc discotheque. Okay. So great.

Speaker 5: What do you think? Judge.

Speaker 4: Oh, no. I'm not judging. I'm actually kinda it's all I can think of now. Great.

Speaker 6: Back to Mobile now.

Speaker 5: I don't know if that's

Speaker 4: Mobile's a dangerous place for you, my friend. Oh, boy. Great. Talk about the draft. What are your thoughts? Like, what are you looking for for this team, in in the first three rounds? Like, what do you hope to really see?

Speaker 5: Well, I mean, I I'm with everybody else. I think you look at, you know, obviously, Edge and OT are the big ones that jump off the screen, and then you can have, you know, kind of a a back alley fight over whether it's safety, corner, linebacker, tight end, as far as your priorities and where those things match up. I'm gonna need somebody, Russ, Jeff, it's just somebody anybody. I don't care who. Talk me out of Procter being the only guy that's gonna make me cuss if they call his name.

Speaker 4: Okay.

Speaker 5: Because I I tell me the I keep hearing I the guys, the guys at the the athletic football show did the thing and, it was at Lance, I think, or one of them. Anyway, he comes on and they're like, yeah. They give they did their mock draft and they assign Procter to the lions, and then they spend five minutes talking about how he's probably a guard and he's never gonna be able to keep his weight down and he needs to just slide inside and he's a bad fit for tackles. Like, well, why did we why do that? That sounds like a terrible idea. And his tape coming out of college, he's on the ground a lot. I get he's big, he's strong, he jumps high, But is he only gonna be three hundred and twenty five pounds once in Indianapolis in his underwear? And then for the rest of his career, be three sixty and completely useless at tackle? That's that's my nightmare. Yeah. There you go.

Speaker 6: And that's the million dollar, yeah, that's the million dollar question. Like, with Procter, what is the comfortable playing weight for him? Because at one point at Alabama this past year, he was three hundred and sixty nine pounds. And it's just like, I I get your weight's gonna fluctuate. There's gonna be, you know, ups and downs and peaks and valleys and whatnot. But, like, this is one of those things where you gotta find the comfortable playing weight because if you're gonna be the left tackle or right tackle of the future, like, you gotta be able to to have stability and and be able to to have the body control that he does not show consistently early on in the tape study. He got better as the year went on. I will give him, credit there. And he does look to finish and he's got incredibly strong hands. But I thought from time to time, his weight transfer from his post foot to his set foot was so like if he's on the left side, I'm talking about his post foot. So his right foot to his left foot, which is his set foot. And there were just too many times that like it didn't look clean. He looked like he was moving too slow, like clunky feet. And I worry and, like, I'm with you. Like, if they and I I say with Scott off the air all the time. If they draft Procter, like, I see the vision, but I'm really gonna have a lot of doubt and a lot of questions behind the scenes that I probably won't voice too much, because I you you know, whatever reason, but it's one of those things where I question if you if you take him. And I'm I'm just kinda hoping he's off the board, so we don't gotta worry about it. Just let him go and then let us get, like, Monroe Freeling. I feel safer there. He's a good athlete. I can trust that player. He can play left tackle. So I I I would prefer another tackle other than Caden Proctor. I just think there's too many questions.

Speaker 4: Do you think Freeling do you think Freeling falls that far?

Speaker 6: I don't personally I I mean, before the combine even started, I had and Jeff can attest to this, but I texted him and I said, what do you think of Monroe Frieling at six to Todd Montkin, the Cleveland Browns, safe first round pick. They need a left tackle. He's familiar with them at Georgia because he he might not have directly recruited him, but he was there in that recruiting class before he left for Baltimore. What do you think of him? And he goes, I think that's way too rich. And sure enough, we've seen mock drafts him going as high as six. And I just I think he's gonna go because he is the best pure left tackle in the class, and that holds value in war rooms. Like, somebody's gonna swing for him because the potential is through the roof. And if we see the potential, why the hell wouldn't they?

Speaker 4: Yeah. You locked on a career left tackle that you'd never have to think about that?

Speaker 6: Yeah.

Speaker 4: That's that's huge value. Huge value. You got Spencer Fano there too. Good. I don't know if he can fall. The tackle's a big thing. I want if you would, I want you to put on your professor Brown hat that you, well, you seem to be wearing it already, so I think we're good. Take us through the first three rounds of lines. You're you're you are professor Brown, aka Brad Holmes. You've done your analysis. You've seen these players. Where do we go in round one, round two, and one round three? And you're free to trade if you think it's a a a real life possibility.

Speaker 6: Yeah. I mean, so first round, I I mean, I lean towards Caleb Lomu, the offensive tackle from Utah.

Speaker 5: That's my guy.

Speaker 6: I simply say that because when you think of clean bill of health, character, age, position, athleticism, he's all of that wrapped into one. He's only 21 years of age. He's got a he's got a wife. We're going to get married. This is a player that has a clean bill of health. No no real shoulder surgeries that you've gotta worry about coming down the road. Like, that's something that you've gotta worry about, with with a couple of different other players being, you know, Francis Maui Noah as an example. He's got the herniated disc problem that just flared up that that's now being called for a recheck two weeks before the draft. So there's some concern there. But I would go Caleb Lomu, bit of a waist bender, but super flexible in his lower half, really good bend. He's gonna move. He's physical. There's definitely times that he, you know, overcommits to certain things with faster pass rushers where he's gonna have to, you know, dial that back a little bit, maybe take his losses and and redefine his technique and and some of those things. But just as as far as the box that you check for the Detroit Lions over the last five years with this regime, Caleb Lohmus screams Detroit Lion to me personally. Can you get into pick oh, go ahead.

Speaker 4: No. I was just gonna ask because, I mean, all the consensus has him at, like, 24 of all the all the consensuses on the big board we have. Is that reachable? No. Because, I mean, the you you go a little bit, you know, up and down based on on need. But this is the thing I'm I'm I'm wanna think about a little bit. I'm hearing a lot of we're drafting for need versus best player available. Right? And and this is this is kind of a flip from four years ago, five, six, seven, eight, nine years ago when it was like, just take the guy that's the best one out there. Right? I mean, kinda talk through through that for folks. Like, why why are we thinking about a little bit more and able to flex a little on need versus going straight BPA?

Speaker 6: Yeah. I think just with the the need side of things, I mean, we know we need an offensive tackle. Like, there there's just no denying that. Like, for this team to go where they want to go, where you want them to go as a fan, they need to go get an offensive tackle one way or the other. It could be a left tackle, right tackle. The safer pick every time is to take a right tackle because there's more right tackles in this draft than left tackles. But go out and get that offensive tackle. I think there's a huge disservice if you wait to go get that offensive tackle. Like, don't wait for Jude Bowery in round three. Go get your guy that can start right away because the drop off of talent is pretty drastic in my opinion once you get past Blake mill Blake Miller, Max Iannachor. Those guys are not gonna be there at pick 50. So you're not gonna be able to wait for them. I don't care what your mock draft simulator says. It's not gonna be there. So go get those guys in the first round, and that's why I say go for the need. But if they wanted to go best player available, like, yeah, they they might be able to get away with taking a linebacker or a safety there. Linebacker is probably a little rich.

Speaker 7: PACE checkout is offered by your banks and credit unions. So when you shop online at participating merchants, your cards appear in one place, ready to use, and kept up to date. And the best part, your actual card number isn't shared when you check out because boundaries are healthy. Like, no work emails after six. One small step for boundaries. One big leap for checkout. Pays, it checks out. Activation required. See pays.com to learn more. Terms and conditions apply.

Speaker 6: But if you're just simply talking best player available, like, is there a chance Sonny Styles falls within reaching distance for them to draft them? I don't know. Maybe. It sounds like he's going top five, but crazier things have happened. And if it's not that, like, safety, is Dylan Thieneman somebody that they would really like? He seems like a guy that I think Dan Campbell would just, you know, go nuts for because he just kinda screams that type of guy. But end of the day, like, for the Lions, it's it's about addressing where they need to get better. And it's been very clear they wanna get better upfront. And I I just I think that's the sign of, like, screw best player available if they're going out and getting that need. And that best player available might be the offensive tackle anyways because there's enough to go around in the first round.

Speaker 4: Yeah. And and I I don't disagree with you at all just to be to be fair because I and I I I've really pushed for secondary early. I'm evolving my thinking as we go closer, and I think this this does make a lot of sense. Gray, you jumped up and started saying, oh, you know, doing the Kool Aid, man. Oh, yeah. Busting through the wall when he said Lomu.

Speaker 5: Yep.

Speaker 4: I know it's strange for a a young man to come out of college married in Utah, but explain why Lomu is your guy.

Speaker 5: Well, I could you know, not for nothing. If if the Lions go into this season and they move Penei Sewell to left tackle and they draft one of them kids from Utah, I'm taking a victory lap because I've been banging the drum for this since January. And that's where my short attention span kicks in, and I haven't researched the draft piano. I'm kidding. But, yeah, that's the the other thing I'll add, what what Russ said, and it's, you know, it's ironic because now all of them dudes are in Ann Arbor, but he's been coached. He's been coached really well. He's gonna take coaching at the pro level. Coming out of that Utah program, when I was in Seattle covering the Pac twelve at the time when when there still was one, that that Utah program was the most big 10 thing on the West Coast by a mile. Yeah. They just played tough. Every team that played them, and I was, you know, I was there in Seattle with the Huskies, but we also talked to, you know, I'm trying to remember the coach's name, but Washington State at the time. At any rate, you just hated it. Like, they'd come off of that week against the Utes. Like, I hate playing those guys. It's just it's that kind of program. So and especially, you know, with the linemen, they got prototypical size. They've been coached well, all of the stuff that Russ said. The one thing that I will say in all of this is that while we're talking about need and I'm on board, like I said, I've been saying, just grab one of the Utah guys. I don't even care which one. Whichever one you like more. That's not what Brad Holmes is gonna do. He's been so steadfast in this too. He said it again in his last interview. He's like, that's not what I'm doing. I'm gonna take the best football player. I don't give a damn if it's a long snapper. This is gonna happen. We're, you know, we're doing this my way. And, you know, I go back to my you know, I know I've I've been a little, a little off the channel here. I've been off the grid a bit. But my last, addition to the gray area, I talked to Jackson Bevans out there in Seattle coming off of that Super Bowl win for the Hawks, and he he's been covering that team as closely as anybody. And he talked about John Schneider. And when the Hawks had a long run of really bad drafts, and they they did. They had a little run there where they're really hot and then just fell off, and John Schneider came back and in retrospect, he said, that's when I started drafting for need. I started paying too much attention to need, and they kept missing and they kept missing and they kept missing, and it became a real challenge for that program. We don't know the Lions board, obviously. You know, I think about last year with Tylek Williams, the fact that a lot of people had him in the second round. They're like, hell with that. We're not letting him get there late in the first. You know, you mentioned the Cleveland pick at six. That's the pick that I'm I've just got circled in red to screw up the first round in all the mocks.

Speaker 4: Oh, yeah.

Speaker 5: Because Cleveland's gonna try to they're gonna try, like, mad to trade out of that. And if they can't, they're definitely going to pick the wrong player because they're the Cleveland Browns. Like, the guy the the the meme guy on Instagram. We're the Cleveland Browns. And they're gonna do the wrong thing, and everybody's gonna go, wait. What? They what? And it's gonna mess up the order. And then if they trade out, it's gonna mess up the order. That when we get past pick five, I think things are gonna get weird, and that's gonna make this this whole thing go topsy-turvy.

Speaker 4: Yeah. I'll never forget. The thing about Utah that always strikes, there's two, two things. I I I actually know a player out of BYU. He's gonna be senior this year. I'm excited to see what he does, his safety. But the other one is, we the Florida. I was going to visit my son at school, and they were gonna they were playing them. They happened to beat him. It was an unexpected win. It was an upset for sure. But, down frat row, all the Utah uteruses and all the soaking jokes were just incredible.

Speaker 5: It was,

Speaker 4: it was unbelievable. I was like, oh, college is a little bit different now. Right. Okay. Russ, I'll I'll give you a last word in the first round if you want, and then, you can kinda roll into your next piece. I know we we we stopped you mid flow there.

Speaker 6: No. You you're good. You guys are good. Yeah. No. I mean, all on board with Caleb Loma if that was the case. And and to Grace's point, even if they went Spencer Fanu, I I'm good with that either way. Like, just go out, get one of these guys. And as we mentioned too, like, real quick on need and best player available, no doubt draft good football players. That's just a great term, great way of putting things here in Detroit. Just draft good football players. But as, like, the lions put their board together because their board is not gonna look like the consensus offensive line and be like, how is

Speaker 5: it not one of these guys?

Speaker 6: You know, like it just it makes so much how is it not one of these guys? You know? Like, it just it makes so much sense because there are a lot of offensive linemen that fit them. And it it it that even means Caden Proctor. We might have our gripes about him, but he does fit what they're looking to do. So it'll be really interesting there. But moving to the second round

Speaker 4: We really quick. I I I have to say too. Just just they have to throw Hank Frehley a bone at some point, don't they? Instead of making him work with these low, low, like like

Speaker 6: Mid round guys all the time?

Speaker 4: Yeah. Like, he's been reaching. We've gotta give him some talent. I mean, he they've been riding him hard, and and they just gotta give him a break and give him some talent to work with because it's there's too much going away.

Speaker 5: How dare you throw that shade at Colby Soarsdolt. Yeah. So mean.

Speaker 4: At least Jerry Jacobs is playing in the Canadian League. Alright. So let's go.

Speaker 5: I think he just got married. Poor guy.

Speaker 6: Give it a 50. Second round. You know, in a perfect world, I would love to say Gabe Jocas here, or Gabe Jocas, however you say his last name from Illinois, the edge rusher, but I don't think he's gonna be there. So just being real with people. We're we're gonna pivot away from that, and and and we're gonna just kinda go away from what I think a lot of people are thinking about. And while I would love to go with the pass rusher, I'm I'm actually gonna go with the linebacker if he's there, and that's gonna be Josiah Trotter from Missouri. I think that that's a player that they absolutely would love to have, the way he navigates through blocks, the way that he can make offensive linemen have to redirect their angles and regret the angle that they took. So while I think they would love to go get a pass rusher, I don't know exactly how that board's gonna look like. I don't think TJ Parker, Zion Young, Keldrick Falk, those aren't gonna be there. Malachi Lawrence, I don't think will be there. And I don't think, like, an R Mason Thomas or even a Derek Moore, I don't think either one of those guys is going to to necessarily fall into place for them, and and be good fits. And people are gonna go, Yeah, well, he can't cover. I don't care if he can't cover. You still need to be able to stop the run. And just because he didn't cover in the SEC and we don't know exactly what he was being asked to do, doesn't necessarily mean he can't cover. He's still a good athlete. He's fluid in space. You can teach coverage drops. You can fix the way he finds the football. That's all fixable things. And if he runs well, he's gonna run well with tight ends. And either way, okay, he gives up some passes from time to time. You're still stopping the run. He's a disruptive blitzer. There's just so much to like with the way he gets it, gets after it. So I I love the the skill set of of Josiah Trotter if that was the route that they were able to go. I know a lot of people are gonna go, what are we doing? We have Derek Barnes. We have Malcolm Rodriguez, but longevity. I'm thinking about longevity within the linebacker room because outside of Jack Campbell who's not resigned yet, everybody else is on the pretty much the end of their deal or on a one year deal. So you gotta you gotta retool that room a little bit as well, and then just, you know, get into the later portion, of of the draft. You know, pick one eighteen because we don't have a third round pick. If they were to move up, I would certainly feel, you know, a little bit different there. But but just going with a guy that I think fits the lions relatively well, but I don't know if he'll fit every team. That will be Kieran Crawford from Auburn. He's a bit of a stand up pass rusher, but this is a guy that is just super explosive. And I think if you're sliding protection to Aidan Hutchinson, I think Kieran Crawford is a is a player that can really step in and and do some damage and and get some work as as a, probably, a rotational player to start. But with the pieces that they already have, I think he just really blends in well with the room as a true pass rusher, and he was the guy that I thought always stood out opposite of Keldrick Falk. So I I'll go two defensive players and the and the offensive tackle, Caleb Lomuji, Sayah Trotter, and Kaitrin Crawford from Auburn.

Speaker 4: I'm I'm so in on on a pass rush. You you know, I've I've I've preached it before, and and this part, my this opinion hasn't changed. The the fastest way to fix all those holes in the secondary and the injuries that are bound to happen is through the pass rush. It's the only thing we can do. The the less you know, if we'd had a good pass rush, Jerry Jacobs may still be starting on this team because he wouldn't have to cover for twelve minutes, you know, per play. It's it's you just can't put those guys under that kind of duress. And, we we the the pass rush is just just so important. Great. Tell me why you, you're all about, off ball linebackers and and bench warming cornerbacks instead of a pass rush?

Speaker 5: This is this is my biggest question, and this is where Brad's gonna have to earn his money because and, you know, go back a step. For my money, when they changed the draft format for the sake of television, for Thursday night to have the prime time first round, the biggest thing about that, the biggest change, the most substantial change was the night off between the first round and the second round. Everybody got to breathe because it was, you know, just you just kept rolling, and you saw mistakes get made in the second round. And I think it inhibited trades because people were locked in, and and there was no break. And the minute there was that day off, you see people, they reset their board. They get to they get to like, what did the Browns do? Again, what? Okay. I'm wondering what they can do because a guy like Zion Young, for example, I know you mentioned him, Russell, that he's probably gone by fifty. What do you gotta do to get to forty or thirty five or wherever it is that he's at? Because he's the kind of guy that, you know, you could see as a difference maker in that pass rush. And I'm just using him as as an example, not specifically. But if there is a guy on their board where they're like, no. This is the dude that we put on the other side of Aiden and finally finally finally, we answer that question. Like, okay. We can have two. We don't just have to have one that's awesome and then some guys. It can't just be Aiden and friends on that defensive line again. So I wonder about that move and what happens between night one and night two. Because with no third round pick, it's gonna involve punting some stuff probably from 2027, to to make those moves, but I it feels like the kind of year where Brad's gonna have to move around a lot. Yeah. I I I think he's gonna do it the first round. I mean, I I think if they can trade back and pick up a third, they probably do that because you've got guys, you know and, again, I'm drafting for need, which is not what Brad does, and I'm making myself a hypocrite. But you trade back, and all of a sudden, Blake Miller from Clinton's there. And you're like, okay. This guy doesn't have the ceiling, but the floor is pretty good, and he can be it from day one. You're you're right to act, and you're adequate, and you're good, and go. And then you get something else along the way that you need because I I he's gonna have to move around. I think seventeen and fifty if they pick at seventeen and fifty, I'd be shocked.

Speaker 6: I'm with you a 100% on that because I I've talked about that on with Scott or I've talked about it in my head maybe. I don't know. There's a lot of there's a lot of voices these days, but, I've said the same thing. Like, I I don't think they're staying at one of those picks. They're either moving up at 17 or moving down or they're moving up from 50 or moving down. One of the two things is happening there. I think they've just got too much day three capital where, like, if you look at the pieces that they've added, like, they need to add more talent, no doubt about it, but I don't know if they're gonna use all these picks. So the ability to move up and I just wonder, like, is there enough ammunition in the tank where they say, f it, we're gonna take 50 and we're gonna get into the back end of the first round? Like, Seattle only has four picks. Right. You could get to 32 and probably make them a hell of a deal that they can't refuse. And then you go out and you get your pass rusher. It's probably a little rich, but I think it's very possible that they walk away with a really good offensive tackle and a damn good defensive end, just because of how how this is gonna play out. That's what I think.

Speaker 4: Yep. Alright. I'm gonna come at you guys with something out of the blue. Alright? This is I I'm I'm gonna talk about a a somewhat silly kind of thought experiment I went through in the early days of the podcast that's starting to pop back up in my head. K? It's all about backup quarterback. Right? The most important the most important position on the roster. But the problem is is if your quarterback is down and you're the Detroit Lions, you're done. You you wrote off another season. You wrote off all that talent for a year. There is no hope of you doing anything. Right? So you wanna back in the days of Sean Hill, you had a you had probably at the time the most talented backup in the league. Right? Now there's we we've struggled. We've struggled mightily with the at the backup position. Do you just say, you know what? We're fucked if we have backup, if we have to go to the backup. We know it. We're just not gonna have one. Tom Kennedy is gonna be our backup quarterback. Right? And and we're gonna use that position for a rotational rusher or something.

Speaker 5: David Montgomery is a Texan now.

Speaker 4: So Well, I I understand. I understand. But I I know. This is, again, a crazy thought experiment, but we've got nothing that's ever got had been able to get us through even a quarter of a game at backup. We lose. Right? Why not just admit it, throw it aside? Again, Tom Kennedy or somebody else, give him the the the ball. Let him throw the damn ball. And, if you're in that situation just to get you through because you wrote off anyway and get yourself, like I said, another pass rusher or some kind of talent that's actually going to help the team while you're starting quarterbacks in there. Crazy? I know. But what do you say, Russ, first?

Speaker 6: Yeah. I don't think it's a it's a bad idea. I mean, I don't know if this is necessarily the class to go do it. I don't love this class at all, but we're talking about a backup quarterback. And I think there's some intrigue with a couple of guys. Like, I you know, you're not gonna go and get Mendoza, of course. You're not gonna get Ty Simpson. And I don't, like, I don't think Carson Beck's a player that would match up well with this team. But, you know, Cole Payton from North Dakota State, that would be somebody that I could see them taking a liking to, but he might go a little bit sooner than some might think, just because there's a lot of tools there. But when you think about a quarterback that can make a lot of throws, he can make the far hash throws. He can push the ball vertically down the field. He's got the mobility. He's left handed like Tim Tebow, kinda has that wind up motion a little bit, and he likes to throw off his hitch step a little bit more than his his drive foot and drive him forward on on his throws. But, I I think I think there's enough there with Cole Payton. If they went that route, I could see the vision. If they went with, like, a Kade Clubnik, there's a lot of tools there to work with, but you're gonna need some time. And I think that's the biggest thing. Like, just if you were to get thrown in the fire, it might not be pretty, but Clubnik and Peyton might be two guys worth, like, sitting and kinda getting those guys rounded and and a little bit more skilled and and polish it up, to to to kinda take the next step if they had to step in and be that guy. And I guess the roll of the dice would be like Luke Altmaier from Illinois. He's a he's a local kid. I believe he went to West Bloomfield here. So, I could be butchering that. He I he's definitely from the Metro Detroit area, but that might be a guy that they've got some some information on. They've done that kinda local Detroit kid here, recently with, like, Avante Maddox, Larry Borum, things like that. So maybe they they consider that at quarterback, but we'll see.

Speaker 5: What about Drew Aller late late in the two hundreds? Because he's kinda he's kinda fallen out of favor, but there was a hot minute there where he was Yeah. He was amongst the top contenders. He he strikes me as the kind of guy that might be worth a flyer late in the draft.

Speaker 6: I would take a I would definitely roll the dice on him. I mean, I I don't know if he would last that long, because when you think of, like, tools and arm strength, like, the ball just pops out of his hands. Yeah.

Speaker 4: And

Speaker 6: he's got the mobility to extend plays. The biggest issue with him is just the injury. Right? He's coming off that ankle injury, and his processes is not always there. Like, there are times that he does not see the field well. And then when he does, there are times that he just makes some really odd choices and, like, fires the ball a 100 miles an hour. It's just for him, it's always like fastball, no change up. Gotta get a little bit more touch there, but I I I do like Drew Allard. I think he gets a little bit of a bad rap. So if he ended up falling here and this was a guy that they swung for, I I wouldn't be upset about it. I would kinda be like, what what the hell are we doing? But it would also depend on, you know, what else did we draft. Right? I think that's always the other thing. Like, for sure, taking a QB, what else do you have? You know? What else did you get? So

Speaker 4: You know,

Speaker 5: and and, Chris, to to your point, I always think about this because, of course, Teddy Bridgewater's back in the fold. Right? John Clayton, the professor, I I had the chance to work with him for a few years there when I was in Washington, and he had databases on everything. And he basically went through the history of the league and and made this point about backup quarterbacks. The best case scenario you can get for whatever window of time you're using your your backup quarterback is to play 500 ball. Over the tour course of the league, every team, generations, different games, 16 games, you know, but the when the rules weren't the rules and the quarterbacks could be murdered on live television and then made fun of on Miller like commercials. But all throughout all of it, the best backup quarterbacks you could have in any scenario was about about 500 ball. So it really kinda doesn't matter. Like, if you're a winning team and you've got a six game window and three losses is okay, like we've seen with the Niners, They somehow magically do it every year. They need to go two and two over a four game stretch, and they go two and two over a four game stretch every damn time. You know, I think that's that's where you're at.

Speaker 4: Which 500 ball in the playoffs, though. You know what I mean? Because because you don't get what you want, and you just screwed your draft position. Right. I know this is this is this is, like, completely outside of the box. Right? But I'm like, if you're gonna you're gonna tank anyway, if you're playing your backup for any period of time, you might as well just let it tank. Put Tesla. Put Kennedy behind behind center and let it tank. Let it freaking tank and get yourself talent that when you're healthy and you have a shot, you have the best possible shot to win. It's, again, it's crazy talk. Nobody else is doing it, but it's, you know, it's dumb like a fox, I guess, you might wanna say.

Speaker 8: The grill is shot. The chairs are held together by optimism. And what happened to the rug? Sounds like your outdoor setup is not ready for patio season. Season. Fix it all with Wayfair. Shop Wayfair for grills, rugs, furniture, and more. With 20,000,005 star reviews, room of choice delivery, and expert setup on qualifying orders, it's never been easier to do more for less. Get 10% off your first eligible purchase. Hurry to wayfair.com or download the app now. Wayfair. Every style. Every home.

Speaker 4: Alright. Alright. Alright. So, Greg, let's talk about something. The player that you are absolutely in love with, but it would take an outright miracle for the Lions to be able to pick him up. And and but it can't be it's gotta be it's gotta be somewhat realistic. Right? You're not taking Mendoza. Right? It's no. Yeah.

Speaker 5: Man, I haven't you know what? I think it's probably proof positive of my current mind space. I haven't allowed myself to even dream.

Speaker 4: Yeah. I'm kinda there too.

Speaker 5: I'm like, no. Nothing ever is gonna go right again, and everything's gonna be terrible forever. So yeah. I I mean, I've I've been so locked in on offensive tackles, which is like, I'm it's one it's a guard away from being the dullest draft pick that there is, and there but for the Goster shareless of it all, I'm just praying it doesn't go terribly wrong.

Speaker 6: What a Paul Goster shareless, man. Always thought he could be something. You know?

Speaker 5: So did the lions. Yeah.

Speaker 4: Hey. Let's not forget that Indianapolis also thought he was gonna be a little something.

Speaker 5: Yeah. Yeah, man. I I don't I don't have a good answer for that. Because the the the guys that you would want are elite defensive players if you're not going tackle.

Speaker 4: Sure.

Speaker 5: Yeah. And the elite defensive players, like, there's damn few of them, especially in that first round, and there's just no chance.

Speaker 4: And and part of the problem is is if if if they fall, it's likely a a a Laramie Tunstall kinda gas mask bong situation.

Speaker 5: Please let one of them do that, by the way. Like, if we could get that kid from Ohio State, the gas mask bong, the night before the draft, I'm all in. Yeah. Push him down to 11, trade up. Let let's go. It just that worked out pretty good for the Texans for him to, you know, do an Afroman right before the draft, and then he's he's been a absolute force of nature ever since.

Speaker 4: I just set up a 122,000,000,000 parameter model locally here. I wanna wanna see if I can create a video of him, with the gas mask and release it the day before I

Speaker 5: I can work on it

Speaker 4: for you guys. Okay? Right. Russ, where where are you at, man? Where's the where's where are you feeling? Who's your dream guy that you know isn't gonna be there, but if everything just worked out right,

Speaker 6: you'd

Speaker 4: be able to, feel an explosion between your legs.

Speaker 6: I mean, I would be pretty excited if they got Josiah Trotter at at 50. I don't care what the chat was saying about, you know, coverage skills or anything like that. He's one of my favorite players in this draft. I don't think he'll be there at 50, but, you know, there are mock drafts where he's sitting there at, like, 58, 59. So I guess you could, you know, say that would be one of the guys. But just specifically, like, first round, I would say if at any point, Ruben Bane just falls into their lap at, like, eleven or twelve Yeah. Right before the Rams at thirteen. For god's sakes, don't let him go to the Rams because that's what worries me. I said I tweeted that after the combine or something, a photoshopped picture of him in the Rams. And I'm like, the the NFL is gonna let him fall to the Rams. I just know it. But that would be the guy for me. I think he's the best pass rusher in this draft. I know he's got shorter arms. I know the NFL might view him as more of like a three tech. I know going into the draft cycle, he had a lot of consensus second round grades from NFL scouts, but he's a player that when you watch his bend, his flexibility, the power, he did not win me over right away. I have text proven that as well where I'm like, I don't know about this guy. He just looks like a a little bit more of a physical, longer strided Josh Paschal. But then the more I watched, the more I fell in love. So that would be the guy in the first round where I'm like, man, sprints to the podium, go get, yourself, Ruben Bane. And if it's not him, I'm gonna go with his teammate. If at any point, they can get in a position, and I know we've talked about defensive back and how unrealistic it is to to probably take it the first two rounds. But if at pick 50, they can move up and get a player like Keonte Scott or just get him at 50. I don't care how old he is, draft good football players, and that is a guy that is a Detroit lion all day long. He might be 25, and he might have questionable Auburn tape. But the way he played at Miami this past year and you're looking for a weapon, a guy that can provide an impact on defense because we talk about how Hank Fraley needs a guy. He needs a dude in the first round. Help him out. Get rid of the mid round guys. I'll be honest. Calvin Shepard needs a guy. He he it's not he's been kinda dealt somewhat of a poor I don't wanna say a poor hand because there's a lot of talent there, but he hasn't been dealt much on his side of the football yet to give himself a player to work with. And I think Keontae Scott would be a player he would love. He's just a he's a he's a dog, man. He's an absolute dog.

Speaker 4: Right. Okay. I'm gonna ask you guys to put on your hater mask right now. Okay? I want you to look at Brad Holmes. I want you to look at all his drafts, and I want you to say and and and injured players is is not an allowed thing. But what is his major malfunction? What's the thing that drives you bananas about Holmes and the way he drafts, and what do you think is, the the thing that's kind of held us back in that that

Speaker 5: Man, that's tough. Because I don't I don't think he's a really tough question. Yeah. I don't think this there is a little bit of revisionist history because the Lions fell so flat last year, and they flamed out of the playoffs the year before. So that's a long time to watch a team not do the thing you thought they were gonna do. And I get that everybody's impatient. But the only reason we thought they were gonna do the thing that we we thought they were gonna do is because Brad Holmes has been going through the draft like Darth Vader and just zapping everybody. He's had his misses. And, like, I already mentioned that the second rounders are the ones that kill me because it takes me back to Martin Mayhew and the nightmare of the second round for that guy and all of the misses that piled up because those guys make up such an important depth of your of your roster. You know, you need them dudes to come through. We've seen what's happened with Laporta and Branch and how vital they are. Well, imagine if Levi and Pascal had been just contributors, just rotational pieces on that d line. We're not having this conversation about we still need an edge because they were me, their guy. So I I I don't wanna get carried away like, oh, Brad Holmes has gotta stop doing blah blah blah. The injury thing is obvious, you know, and I think he has to some point correctly pointed out, like, find me a guy who plays football at this level who's never been hurt. Like, holler at me. Aidan Hutchinson missed a lot of time in Michigan, and he came out and he got his legs snapped in half. It happens. Right? You know, he's still he's still worth the pick, and stop it, Jacksonville fans, with the, we're happy we didn't take Hutch. No. You're not. Right. It's and thank you for not doing that, by the way.

Speaker 4: Thank you for

Speaker 5: your attention on that matter. Yeah. So I don't wanna I don't wanna get it I don't wanna get carried away that that that he's been doing this terrible job. It's gonna be tough coming off those back to back years not having that third round pick. You know, Russ Hardy mentioned it. The amount of the amount of stuff he's willing to give up for his guys at times has been maddening. And I'm looking at Broadrick Martin, and I'm looking at Hendon Hooker, and I'm looking at, Giovanni Manu. And, you know, maybe, fingers crossed, it works out with Tesla because he's the latest one. He looks like a dude. He came and every chance he got to do something this year, he did something. So he looks like a dude, but they've man, he goes after his guys. So if he could tone down the I guess that that would be my thing. Tone down the aggression this much.

Speaker 6: Just Yeah.

Speaker 5: Don't lose your mind. You didn't have to trade anything away for Giovanni Manu. You did. Right. And please stop stop drafting people from Saskatchewan coed leagues. Like, can we just not do that? I get it. He's big and he's strong and he jumps fast and he's got a fun name, but we we gotta stop with that.

Speaker 4: So, Russ, other than me, nobody's perfect. You gotta find something wrong with, Brad here. What do you got?

Speaker 6: Yeah. I I was I was gonna say that. The the conviction I can't fault him for the injuries that happen to players. Shit happens. You cannot blame him for somebody getting hurt. You can blame him for taking a swing on a guy, like trading up or doubling down, like an NS Raichstra, for example. You can kinda blame him for taking him because you knew the injury history. And once you get to lower body ailments, it's a red flag all day long because the chance of it reoccurring are much more higher than it not. But at the end of the day, I admire a guy having conviction, and he talks about the word conviction all of the time. And he drafts with conviction. He goes out. He likes his guys. They find guys and identify them as players that fit them, and they go out and get them. And I can't fault them for that because I'd much rather have him pounding a table and being pumped up than holding a baseball bat like Bob Quinn. Like, I just would. But at the end of the day, I wish he attacked free agency as aggressive as he does the draft at times. Like, I'm I don't need you to go out and spend all of the money, and I don't need you to go out and spend long term deals on players and and overspend and do that because I don't believe overspending in free agency. That's not how good football teams are made. It's made in the draft. But if it's made in the draft and you value those picks, why are you so up on this every single year? I'm gonna trade away future capital to take a swing on such an unknown player in the third round. Why don't you take that swing in the first round and go get the for sure guy, the guy that's gonna help you? So I think it's more so I'm good with you being convinced to go get a player, and I'm cool with how you navigate through business on a day to day basis. But in the draft, I want you to be a little bit more sure and a little bit more aggressive in the first round. And I know it takes two to tango, and it's hard to move up. But screw it, man. Go be aggressive this year and go get your Ruben Bane. Go get your Sonny Styles. Go get that player that's gonna take you to the next level. And to be honest, I don't know if this is the year to do that because I think they still have a little bit of ways to go still. Like, they gotta go get the tackle. They gotta go get the pass rusher. But just I don't know. I would like to see that moving forward. Like, once you iron this out, we see where we are. And then in 2027, if you are a pass rusher away, damn it, go get the guy. Just go get him. So

Speaker 4: Yeah. And, you know, there's as as I said, there's not a lot to criticize about him. But the one of the things, you know, they talk about you talk about self scouting, and it's it's it's great to be a fan. It's great to like your players and your and your coaches and your GM and all that, but you have to go wide eyes open. You have to be able to see. Here's where we need to be better. These are the things that aren't working. Because if they continue to compound over time, those are the types of things that become real stoppers for progress. I'm gonna pivot a little to the NFL as a whole. There's a a lawsuit going on. And and, frankly, as much as I love football and hate the refs and the whole situation with that.

Speaker 5: You almost made it through an entire show without throwing the refs under the bus. It's April.

Speaker 4: I I I hope they get

Speaker 5: fucked in

Speaker 4: a negotiation. I really do. But, anyway, the

Speaker 5: say that, but we're gonna get some nonsense, like, intermural league refereeing and Who's that? We

Speaker 4: got now, though. That's what I'm gonna do.

Speaker 5: Don't say it can't get worse. Don't do it.

Speaker 4: Get worse. Yourself. Getting worse every year. But this is that's not what I was I I had to get my complaint in. But the thing I'm thinking about is the the lawsuit, the antitrust suit about the fact that you have to spend $1,700 a year to be able to see all of the games and the, the anticompetitive practices about the TV stuff with them and the contracts. How is it that the NBA and MLB and NHL can get this shit right? Although, I gotta say, the Tigers and a couple other teams really fucking off the rails this year with their stupid shit. But, I mean, generally nine. Generally, everybody gets it right except the NFL. NFL is great for the NFL. Right? But for fans, what a royal pain in the ass. And I have a feeling that if they keep this up like this, the the average life of a fan is going to shrink. I think it's it's going to actually hurt them because they're not people aren't gonna be able to see the games. They're not gonna be able to see their teams. You move away, you can't see your team unless you drop $300 plus all the other shit to see it when they're on that when we're not they're not on your $300 a year fucking YouTube subscription. It's crazy. Right? I think people are just gonna say fuck this and walk away. And they really put themselves if the economy takes a a turn to the south, they really put themselves at risk because this is one of those things that people will will will budget right out of their their spend. Yeah. Where are you at on the TV thing, Russ? I mean, what what do you have any thoughts on what might be a better approach for that's fan friendly, but it can still make them a couple of bucks?

Speaker 6: I mean, I think you just kinda follow the same model as the MLB. Like, they have MLB TV for a $189 in a year, a $150 for the year, and you get a 162 games. I get I I get to see NFL, but, I mean, okay. A $150 for the year. You can call it Sunday ticket, call it whatever you want, but you get everything. You just go to that on your smart TV or on your cable provider. It's an attachment, whatever what I mean, it's $20.26. If you don't have a smart TV and you're operating with the big dome box thing power to you, but, you're probably not yeah. You're not watching it anyways. So, and at that point, you can still get it on channel two or whatever the case may be. But, you know, yeah, I I just think you you streamline it all into one thing, and there is no we're going to NFL network today, Netflix tomorrow. You can put it all on Netflix. I don't care. Everybody's got Netflix. Just figure it out and put everything somewhere and you don't have to change anything. You can keep everything the same, but I I don't know that they've they've they've done this for so long, and they've been in the, you know, the the the regional networks for so long with the the stuff with Fox and NBC and CBS for for my entire life. So, I mean, all they've done is made it more complicated by getting everybody else involved. And the moment you went away from keeping it simple, it all kinda took a shit. And I don't know. There's a there's a saying out there. Simplicity is genius. Just keep it simple, make it easy, and you'll make your money. It's that simple. It's that simple.

Speaker 4: So, Gray, the one thing about it is is it's one of the I think it's one of the key things that's kept the salary salary cap growing. Right? Is the is all that money that's coming in from all these different deals. So I can say, like, fine. Stick with your 300 Sunday ticket, wherever you wanna put it, but put it in one place. Let me see. I don't care if it's on another network. Show me the other network's commercials. You can do that. You can completely do that. Because, again, if it's on YouTube TV, for example, you know what? If it's on the network, I'm seeing the fucking commercials on YouTube t TV anyway. You could just play them here. Right? I mean, it's you have the technology, the capability. Don't give me that BS, you know, nineteen ninety eight answer. But they make it fair for the fans. The salary cap kinda stagnates. What what does that mean? What does that do?

Speaker 5: Well, I I think the the real issue is is scale. And this is the problem with comparing the NFL to any of the others. The MLB TV deal is gonna make them $2,000,000,000 a year. NBA has got an eleven year deal for 76,000,000,000. The NFL makes 12 a season. It's six fold the NBA or the MLB. It's it's so massive. And Roger Goodell's crowning achievement, the reason he's still in that office all these years later is because he figured out correctly that the NFL is a TV show. It's not a game. And once it became a TV show, everything about the television thing was what what drove it. They're trying to grow audience in Europe, and I they'll have some mix, but, you know, whatever. They can there's only 330, 340,000,000 people in The United States. Right? So the only way that you can continue to make more money, to make the salary cap grow, to do all the things that his fans, we wanna see our teams do. Russ wants Brad Holmes to go out and spend a bunch of money on free agency. Well, guess what? That money comes from Apple TV and Prime TV and all the streaming bullshit and making it in like, I you know, I've gotta go to six different sub screens on my phone. Where's the game again? And, you know, I'm a I'm a guy that had to you know, where I live, I had to subscribe to the to the ticket. Well, you know what? You still need something for Thursday. You still need something for the holiday games. You still need there's another one on Netflix. But that's the only way the NFL is gonna grow that revenue is to invite those streamers in to continue to subdivide and incubate new TV products. They learned the absolute it's like giving your kid a cookie for coming home late. The TV networks and this is a little history lesson for everybody. The TV networks tried to punish the NFL once. One time with Thursday Night Football, they wouldn't buy it. They wouldn't buy it from the NFL. Like, nah. Nobody's gonna watch this. And the NFL said, you know what? You know? Watch this. And they put it on the NFL network, and they let it grow into a monster. And then there was a bidding war because all the TV networks that were, you know, holding holding their money, like, tight to their chest, They saw this thing grow, and the NFL network was making the money on both sides because it's a league network and also their revenue is growing from that. And then they made mad loot by selling off the rights. Yep. Until the damn audience shrinks, the NFL's not gonna stop anything.

Speaker 4: Yeah.

Speaker 5: You're telling them to stop making more money. And that's like, they have found a thing that to this point, nothing has slowed down.

Speaker 4: But the the problem you find is when it slows down and when it reverses, because you keep pushing, it eventually happens.

Speaker 6: Right.

Speaker 4: It tumbles hard, and it goes and there and there's and and you see company after company after company try to stop loss all the way down to zero. You know what I mean? And that's where you gotta kinda balance it. I mean, you can still grow the cap. You can I mean, how much money are they making in in just pure profit? I mean, the value of the teams to the owners alone from their initial investments and the rate of return on those is through the roof. That's all gonna go away if they if they burn the fans with this this whole product. I think one of the things that would I would be interesting and I and I I I know this is controversial and people won't like it, but,

Speaker 1: got a Sam's Cafe pizza order up. You know the best part about this spicy Italian sausage? I voted for this topping. Yeah. Just another perk of being a member. Come join us.

Speaker 4: Sam's Club. We used to go to, Cologne a lot when I when I was in the, Ford World. And, I I I used to go and see the the Kona Haiya, their their hockey game in, or their hockey team in in Cologne. And they had, like, a big Ford logo on their jersey and a couple other logos. And I it was like NASCAR top, basically. I kinda thought it looked pretty cool. I thought it was it was pretty neat. Sell those sponsorships and use that to augment the dollars and cents and make this more fan friendly. I I don't think I give a shit that there's a Ford logo on somebody's jersey. I really don't. If I can just get a decent shot at seeing my team all 17 games of the year and in the playoffs without having to fucking jump through hoops. The other thing is I just see, like, my my mother-in-law, we moved her down here because she's she needs some help and that kind of thing. And, old folks, folks that have been fans for a long time, are having a fuck of a time trying to find these games. You know what I mean? Do you know how hard it was for me to my mom lives in Detroit. She's a total Tigers fan. To try to get her the Tigers every year with all the shenanigans and crap going on from down here is a pain in the ass. And then, I mean, it took an hour to get her to type in a username and a password and the Roku to get it to work. You know what I mean? She's 80 years old. This is stupid. This is absolutely stupid, and you're and you're killing yourself out of revenue by making it so hard for people who aren't 18, 25 years old.

Speaker 5: But here's the here's the here's the thing. Now as much as I I know free market capitalist you are, you know, I I I think it's adorable on the one hand. You think any businessman is thinking that far down the line. Man. I think it's more adorable that you think anybody in the league offices gives a shit about the fans. Yeah. Like like, I mean, I don't want it. Again, my mind space, it's kind of a sewer in here right now. But they they they haven't once even seen a hiccup. There hasn't been a COVID came and went. Empty stadiums. Didn't matter. The thing just kept rolling. It was like, oh, this is gonna kill the salary cap. Oh, remember that? Yeah. Me neither. It just keeps growing. And I know Rizdyn's been all over this with some of his videos where the projection for the salary cap on if you just look at the last five years, like, oh, it grew a $100,000,000 a team. Look at that. Let me talk about that. You know, like, how can you pay somebody $60,000,000 a year? Well, it's easy. We just keep printing this stuff.

Speaker 4: Yeah.

Speaker 5: I don't I don't there's been no indication that they're gonna do that, and I have yet to see an industry run by anybody like these dudes whoever saw their demise coming

Speaker 4: Right.

Speaker 5: And did anything proactively about it. They hit that iceberg every time.

Speaker 4: I think the biggest piece of bullshit is that it's you that's calling me adorable, not some sweet, young, beautiful thing.

Speaker 6: Buddy, take

Speaker 4: what you can get. Alright? I don't

Speaker 5: know if you have clubhouse mirrors in that joint. I told you to take it.

Speaker 4: I'm like, don't stand back there and say take it. That's not how it's going.

Speaker 5: At least buy your dinner first.

Speaker 4: Oh, man. No. It's it's it's wild how how how this is going, but, we'll see we'll see what happens. I mean, I I predict potentially a a a surge in the in the Florida teams. I mean, if you look at just the sales tax thing for the players themselves and where they wanna go, There's or or the income tax there's no income tax in Florida. We're about to vote out property tax. So there you buy your house, you just own it now. You there's no rent to the government or anything. Oh, what? You have kids? Here's free tuition to college. Go ahead. I mean, all the stuff that, like, all the the founders are it's already here. Right? Right. I can see a real incentive for sports players and the big money folks to come rolling into Florida and take advantage of all that stuff because the one thing they have is the mobility to be able to do it. So we'll see we'll see how that plays. Anzalone isn't maybe the the poster child for that, but I'll leave that one be. Alright. Let's get closer to close. Russ, I wanna just give me an overview on the draft. Give me your thoughts, and and what might change between now and the draft?

Speaker 6: Man, what could change between now and the draft? I mean, I I think if anything, we'll get a lot of clarity as as far as, you know, I think some medicals with players. I mean, that's already starting to happen. But, like, Jordan Tyson being one of those players, there there was often a thought that he was gonna be the first receiver off the board. He might end up being the fourth or fifth receiver off the board. I'd probably keep tabs unlike him to maybe Philly, at pick 23. But as a general scope of the draft, I I I like this class. I don't love this class. I have a lot of doubts about a lot of position groups, specifically running back and interior defensive lines, so defensive tackles. I really struggle with those defensive tackles because, like, early in the process, I'd I'd watch Lee Hunter, and I'm like, man, there's a lot of potential. Same thing with Caleb Banks. And then I'd go down the list, and then I'd, you know, get through some testing, go through more film. And I'm like, he but, yeah, but he does this, and he does this wrong. And he does this play right, but then he does these three other things wrong. So I I don't love this defensive tackle class as much as I did when I started. And I just kinda question, like, what this class could be when it's all said and done. Like, I I think maybe one of the better defensive tackles coming out of this class is a player nobody's even heard of or talked about, and that's Auburn defensive tackle Bobby Jamieson Travis. Like, super fun nose tackle that's six three, three twenty eight, thirty four and a half inch arms. Like, really fun player, but probably gonna be a priority free agent. So I think he might be a little bit better than some of these other guys. So that's just my opinion on it, but, I I I I just struggle with the defensive tackles. I struggle with the running backs as well. Outside of Jeremiah Love, it just feels like a bunch of guys that are just guys. And I know a lot of people are like, we gotta find somebody to replace David Montgomery. Isaiah Pacheco's injured, and it's like, I'm with you. I I would love for them to take a swing at, like, you know, Washington running back Jonah Coleman or Caitron Allen, but there's some off the field stuff with Caitron Allen. And, again, these are guys that just never really became the guy. They're just kinda guys, and I worry. Like, I I know we don't need him to be the guy, but, like, end of the day, you gotta go get somebody that's gonna contribute. And I just I I think it's a very average draft in general. There's gonna be some good there's gonna be some role players. There's gonna be a run of centers between rounds three through five. There's no doubt in my mind there. But but generally speaking, I I think the line is you know, from a lion's lens of things, they're gonna be able to add some, I think, key depth players as far as contributors or role players on the defensive side of the football, specifically at linebacker or safety. I question it at defensive tackle. I think they can find a pass rusher, and I think that they can find another offensive tackle in this class. And then we'll kinda see where the board goes from there for them. Like, how like, what what else are they going to add? I could they add a receiver? Could they add a tight end? What does the rest of the board look like? Because when you look at how they've done things with the one year deals, there's not really a lot of spots on the board left, and they got a lot of picks. So it's gonna be really interesting, in in general there, but I hope I gave a a decent scope of how the draft's gonna look.

Speaker 4: Would would you say the defensive tackles are adorable?

Speaker 6: I I mean, their pictures are fine, I guess. You know? But when when you watch them play, there's times where you're like, I don't know what this guy's doing. He's hideous.

Speaker 4: To your point, I think we have a lot of guys. I I think we need dudes. That really is what it is. Now I think back to, you know, where Gray was talking about in the year years of Mayhew Mayhew. We had dudes. We had the Sus, and we had Staffords, and we had but we had no guys. Right? And when a dude gets hurt and you got no guys, it's all over. Right? And that's that's a lot of what we experienced. So dudes, guys, and, all that. It's dudes, guys, and gray. Gray, what do you think about, what's the big thing for the your big storyline for the draft start?

Speaker 5: Well, the I mean, there's two things. I'll start with the really obvious ones. Regardless whether it's a tackle, backer, an edge, a safety, you have to get the first and second round picks right. You you gotta get players. You've gotta get impact players. And that's a scary place to be because you're in this, you know, let's use the parlance that everybody likes. You're in the window. And so the fact that there is so much pressure on those picks, not just from Brad Holmes' perspective and the the Lions' perspective, but also from the player. You know, this guy's gonna come in. The the weight of a franchise with championship expectation is gonna be on that first round pick, gonna be on that second round pick. They gotta come in and and produce right away. That's the obvious thing. The other thing, and this is just a personal thing for me, we are officially today. It's Thursday. We are two weeks from the first round. Right? There's always somebody who crashes out. There's a draft pick who's a top 15 guy who does something mind numbingly stupid and gets pulled over by the cops or burns a house down or hits the bong at the like, whatever it is. Like, oh, he's in a dog fighting ring. Like, there's gonna be something's gonna happen with that guy, and then there's going to be one of the dumb teams. Look Looking at you, Browns. Looking at you, Raiders. Looking at you know, there's gonna be one of those teams that's gonna do something nobody's talking about right now before that first round. There's gonna be that your Max Crosby will get traded. It'll shuffle first round. You know? Whatever it is, you know, this is my favorite two week period of this whole pre draft run up because I know someone's about to do something really stupid. And you just hope it's not you hope, obviously, it's not your team. Please, Jamieson Williams, stay out of the headlines. That'd be great. It's this is this is that window when something nutso happens almost every year. You know, you go back to, what was the defensive tackle the Eagles ended up taking from Georgia, got in all the trouble with his car?

Speaker 4: Oh, yeah.

Speaker 5: Jalen Carter. Jalen Carter. I was gonna say Jalen Hertz, I'm the wrong Jalen. Me and names. It's there's always there's gonna be one of those. You know, I know Mau now has they got the he's got the health stuff and and the concerns and the recheck on things. Agents are gonna go nuts. You know, the the the Procter thing. All of a sudden, you know, Dane Bruggler mentioned something about Procter and then Lance Zuerlein grabs that flag and runs it up to him. And now Procter, like I said in my little roundup, he went from being, an ancillary guy to most people now, or just giving Procter to the Lions at 17. You know, there's going to that this is the this is the fun part because everybody starts talking, nobody knows the truth, everybody buys everything, all of the click baits out there. And if if nothing else, it makes the middle of April when the Red Wings suck and the Tigers can't get out of their own way. You know, it makes it fun.

Speaker 4: I remember when the Red Wings were the best team in hockey.

Speaker 5: Yeah. Right up until March, every year for the last three years when they just can't find anything, and they oh, I'm gonna get me started on the wings. Oh, I'm good. Well right now, Matt.

Speaker 4: So I'm I'm here's where my head's at on the draft, and it it's very Lions specific. Since '17 in that crash out, it's been, for Lions fans, a real difficult ride. It's been and it's it's funny because, I mean, from the outside looking in, somebody could easily say, guys, it's the fucking Detroit Lions. I mean, have you seen your team? Right? I mean, if you look at any kind of, over time, kinda look at the team, they're still historically great. Right? But I really worry that that fifteen and two burned, and then last year with the expectations where they were and then just an absolute fourth place shit show. I mean, you look you you look at where things turned around and how far they fell. I don't know how much rope the fans are gonna give Very good. Brad Holmes and Dan and and Dan Campbell area because it's such a different point of view at this point. And and, you know, it's always the, you know, the the grass is always greener, and I think that they're an absolute victim of injuries that are, in most cases, are completely out of their control. Some were some bad decisions. Right? But I think we have such a great core. I think the other part is with the Dan Campbell, if if we don't start seeing some good results return, I think it's possible that the the rah rah thing, he can lose some he can lose that locker room because it's just not gonna buy anymore.

Speaker 5: No. It it it wears off on guys really, really fast, especially after they've gotten paid. And that's where the Lions find themselves in a delicate spot. Chris, you and I had this conversation right at the end of the season. You got one more shit season. Yep. Before things are are are falling apart everywhere, you will lose that locker room. Yep. Eventually, all of the you when you get these rah rah coaches I watched Amelon Pete Carroll in Seattle. He had everybody right up until he didn't. And it was after that championship year, and all of a sudden, these guys like Richard Sherman get paid and Russell Wilson gets paid and guys start and now, okay, they always compete thing. That's adorable. You're the old gray haired man that throws a football on the side. That's cute. And Jim Harbaugh, same thing. He wears out his welcome everywhere he goes. Now he's you know, it's a different case. I don't wanna say Dan Campbell's or anything like that. But there there is for the intense guys like that, if you don't get results and then it starts to slide back, if they don't make the playoffs this year, they're gonna have a real hard time getting that thing back on

Speaker 6: the 2021.

Speaker 4: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. That's that's my biggest fear because I think we've actually got it way better than the results show. And I think that the injuries have put us in such a shit spot that it just is gonna reflect on them, and I think you're gonna get that that backlash. And, frankly, I mean, I think Sheila does look at WCF and say, he was the guy that was too loyal. He was the guy that stuck with it too long. He was the guy. And I think she wants to be the anti version of him. I, you know, I don't have it. This is speculation. Right? But she seems in all of the actions thus far to be, like George Costanza. I'm gonna do the opposite of what you know? And, and, wow, this is working great. That it it really feels like that's where we're at, and I worry that we're gonna cut the fuse too short and not get the big boom that we want out of this. So that's my story of the draft. We got we we have to land it. We absolutely have to land it and see results this year.

Speaker 5: It's more important than it has any business being. It's it's not a fair roll of the dice. I know I'm seeing in the comments somebody who's like, nine and eight's a shit season. Well, Brad is really good. Yeah. You lost to Max Brosmer on Christmas day. He had three yards passing. The way that season ended was just ridiculous. And it was a bad year all up, down, win lose, win lose, win lose, win lose, win lose, no consistency. Couldn't figure it out. Had to fire your play caller right after you hired your play. Like, there was a lot going on there. Yep. So they've got a lot of things to steady, get the offense right, make that thing the engine that drives the thing, and you should be okay. They're still the odds on favorite according to everybody in Vegas to win the division. There's no reason they can't. And if they do that, then all of this is wasted gas because

Speaker 6: Exactly.

Speaker 5: They'll be fine.

Speaker 4: Yeah. Yep. Yeah. Well, there we are. That's be my

Speaker 6: oh, go ahead.

Speaker 4: Go go go ahead, Rush. I was gonna show this.

Speaker 6: I was just gonna piggyback off Gray on that. I I was just gonna say, you know, if if Dan Campbell's who we think he is, he's gonna right the ship here. And I said it all all season last year that they had a wedge somewhere in that locker room. I don't know if it was a coach, coaches, player, players. Maybe it's nothing, but, I'm not, like, reporting anything, but it's just one of those things where I felt like there was a wedge in that locker room, and they were never able to get on the same page. And I hope that they got it corrected, and they add to, you know, the pieces to the puzzle here. So we'll see.

Speaker 4: He is who we thought he is. Alright. With that, we're gonna we're gonna rock it out. Russ, Michael, thank you so much for, for rocking this with me. It was a great discussion. Don't forget two weeks until our live draft party, drinking for dollars, all the other stuff that we love to do. It's gonna be a good time. We'll have a lot of fun. We'll do day one and day two of the draft, and then we'll see how it goes. I'm usually just gonna ask my three and we don't do three, but I but it I'm, like, halfway through the day three draft. I'm like, I wish we were doing it, and then I'm like, I'm glad we're not. I it's really it's great. We'll see how it goes. I don't know. No promises for anything on that one.

Speaker 5: Thanks for clearing that up.

Speaker 4: Yeah. I got you covered, bro. Don't forget to put us on Patreon where all the clarity resides. Patreon.com/detroitlionspodcast. Smartest lions chat on the Internet. Get access to the Slack with $5 or more a month and all kinds of other great perks. You get to hang out with Russ and Gray and Fish and Riz and all the Ashes running around making scurrilous faces

Speaker 5: and things like that. Screw him for showing up in the Slack all the time and then not being willing to you you salty, syrupy and prick. Get out here and hang out with us, you jerk.

Speaker 4: Salty, syrupy and prick. I'm pinning that one up. I love it. Man,

Speaker 5: I miss that guy. I want him to tell me I'm wrong about everything like he usually does, but he won't even join us. Come on play, jerk. You're not doing anything up there in your make believe maple scented nonsense country.

Speaker 4: God for seeking forest. Right? Without any port of relative.

Speaker 5: Man, there's nothing there but wind.

Speaker 4: And grizzly bears. Right? There's no elves or dwarves or Snow White or any shit. It's just fucking grizzly bears.

Speaker 5: Absolute truckload of bears.

Speaker 4: And one of them is fucking ash. Make sure to follow us on x. Russ NFL Draft is is Russell's, x account. We got the Michael Gray. Go ahead and grab him as well. And at d e t lions podcast, that's where you can find us. Get in and follow us and have some fun with this in the, in the x space. Also, make sure you go to detroitlionspodcast.com and subscribe to the podcast, and you will get a sexy postcard in the mail. Keep waiting. I'm sure it'll come sometime. Thank you for tuning in. We're gonna see you next time on the Detroit Lions podcast. No pants, no toasters, no hot tubs, no problems, because we are a Detroit Lions and Reddit connection. Thank you all for checking us out and staying with us, and we will we will see you real soon. Bye.