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Speaker 5: What's going on, everybody? Welcome back to another episode of Bischoff and Brown right here on the Detroit Lions podcast. He's Scott Bischoff. I'm Russ Brown. We are back after a, oop, didn't mean to hit that light. But, we are back after, a long week here doing the NFL draft stuff. But, Scott, my man, how are you?

Speaker 6: I'm good. How are you doing?

Speaker 5: I'm good. We're we're good. I I did a little solo thing on here, not for Detroit Lions podcast for something completely different draft related, and I feel like I screwed everything up. So if weird things start happening with the screen, my apologies. But,

Speaker 6: You shit the bet again, buddy.

Speaker 5: Yep. Per per, you know, par for the course. That's per usual around here. That's what I do. But look, we're a week away from the NFL draft, so not much, has really changed outside of, you know, potential rumors that are are kinda hitting the rumor mill. It's obviously that time of the year where smoke screens are firing away, and and we all know that. But there's a lot of rumors, a lot of conversations being had. And I I thought it would be good for us to just kinda I don't wanna say clear the air air because we're not, necessarily, you know, insiders by any means. Sure. We have information that gets sent our way from time to time, but we're not we're not insiders or anything like that. We're just reading the tea leaves. And I would like to just kinda dive into those tea leaves a little bit and and see where it takes us and and if we maybe potentially set the table for the lions with the seventeenth overall pick. Because I wanna be honest with people, we've talked about the offensive tackles. We've talked about the defensive ends. We did the in-depth, you know, day two, day three stuff last week with, you know, seven or eight players a piece, and we we had a blast doing that. But at this point, I feel like the hay is starting to get into the barn and being a week out. We're just kinda rinsing it rinsing and repeating here. So I think we just get into some of the draft rumors. We set the table for the lions. We'll talk about a potential prospect that they've been heavily linked to. But just NFL draft rumors. The biggest one is six and twelve. The sixth pick is the Cleveland Browns. The twelfth pick is the Dallas Cowboys. Over the last two days or so, there's been a lot of national media from Dane Brugler to Todd McShea to Mel Kuper. Everybody seems to be in in this mindset of Dallas moving from 12 to six trading with Cleveland. And that would essentially put Dallas in the driver's seat to take either Caleb Downs, Sonny Styles, maybe it's Ruben Bane, maybe it's Jeremiah Love, or who knows? Maybe it's Carnell Tate. But it seems like they're destined to move up and take a defensive player to help them. And I think Cleveland's very intriguing because Cleveland could move from six to 12 and still be in the driver's seat to take an offensive tackle. Could be Caden Proctor, could be Monroe Freeling, could be Spencer Fanu who everybody seems to think is athletic enough to play just about anywhere. But I think it's really interesting with some of the rumors, and and I'll have some offensive tackle stuff to follow this. But I wanted to turn it over to you as as I always do with kind of the first topic of, you know, thought process. What do you make of these rumors? Do you think there's any truth to it? And, ultimately,

Speaker 1: what do you what do you what do

Speaker 5: you think could potentially happen? I know I know it's a guessing game, and I know you're gonna tell me I'm an idiot. Don't ask that question.

Speaker 6: But No. No. It's good. It's because, I mean, there is that that thing's been out there for I heard it, you know, like a week and a half, two weeks ago that that Dallas was looking to to move up. But the question I have is I don't know why they'd only have to go to six. I mean, I understand it if if if if it is all if it's if Dallas really wants Sonny Styles, and he's available at six, totally get it.

Speaker 5: Yeah.

Speaker 6: But is there a world in which they have to go up past the Giants, because maybe they and the Giants covet the same player? Giants are not gonna do business with Dallas. So Right. I don't know, I mean I think there is a little bit of that out there that, you know, I know the Giants are are supposed to be, digging Caleb Downs' game right now.

Speaker 5: Yeah.

Speaker 6: And and it seems like maybe five is where Downs is gonna go. And I know I can feel the eyes rolling around out there. Just what about positional value? I don't know that it matters so much in this year's draft.

Speaker 5: Yeah.

Speaker 6: Just take really good players. Right? Mhmm. But so if we just if we operate like Stiles is available at six, then I think it's it is very reasonable to think that Dallas could make that move, but what's Arizona doing? So this is what I'm looking at this. Like, what what why would Arizona not potentially take Sonny Styles themselves if he's this super safe prospect with, you know, a high floor, high ceiling, whatever it is, whatever you wanna call it. I mean, I I know they're two very different things, but but it sounds like people the teams are considering styles as as one of the safest, you know, prospects in this entire draft, along with Caleb Downs. So the so that's that's for me is, like, I'm trying to figure out where Reece ends up going. I know I've mentioned three players now in in about thirty seconds. Yeah. No. I'm I'm like the smoke screen going on in my brain. Like, they're all sort of tied together.

Speaker 5: Yeah.

Speaker 6: Do you believe Bailey's gonna go and pick two? Do you really believe the Jets are gonna end up doing that? I mean,

Speaker 5: yes, I can see it. And I only say that because his ability as a pass rusher is certainly intriguing. And I think if you're looking for a guy that could impact right away, David Bailey makes a lot of sense. I don't know if Arval Reese is gonna make that impact the way David Bailey does. But at the same time, we know Aaron Glenn and we know what he values and getting guys that wanna play the run on a consistent level, that's a little bit more of his MO. I don't know if that's necessarily David Bailey. I mean, we've talked about David Bailey in great detail on this show. I have my concerns as a run defender with David Bailey. That's why he's my he's my eighteenth ranked player. He got a a late first, early second round grade on my board, but that's just me specifically. I know, obviously, NFL teams probably view him as a top five talent, and it seems like the national media does as well. Little bit of a conservative approach there. But I I think David Bailey would make some sense. And I think if they are looking for that spark plug, I think he can be that guy. But if it's been Arvell Reese this whole time, what what made them change to David Bailey like that? I mean, what because nothing has come up with Arvel Rees. You know what I'm saying?

Speaker 6: Like You said it. I think it's that he's a a bit of a project who requires some project. Like like I don't wanna use the same word because then No. You go for it. But there but that's it. Like, as a pass rusher, is is Reece a player who you're gonna put as an all time you know, a full time pass rusher if you're the Jets, and the answer has to be a definitive no. Right. So And

Speaker 5: I like him as an off ball backer. So, like Yeah. I Yeah. I I don't know how

Speaker 6: you take them. Like a, like a a Swiss army knife kind of off ball linebacker, Blitzer.

Speaker 5: Yeah.

Speaker 6: A guy who can do a variety of things. Mhmm. But is he is he gonna line up as a defensive end and and bully teams, you know, bully an offensive tackle and set the edge for you? I don't know that Reese is gonna do that. So I haven't necessarily bought into all that the whole time. I just haven't. But that's, you know, that's probably a me problem more than it is anything else. The reality is is that unless there's a trade, the Jets have to make a pick. They gotta take someone. So the player who probably fits best for right now, which doesn't me to for me, doesn't move the needle all that much because are the Jets really looking to do that right now? I mean, are they are they really adding David Bailey to the mix because they think David Bailey helps them win games this year? I'm not buying it. I'm Who's their quarterback?

Speaker 5: You know

Speaker 6: what I mean? Like so But I think it's

Speaker 5: I think it's well known. It'll it maybe it's not. Not I'm not saying well known in the media. I think it's well known in the Jets room. It has to be. Like, hey. We're not winning right away. We have all this draft capital. We've got, you know, I think it's six picks in the top 100 this year. We've got two or three first round picks next year.

Speaker 6: I think it's I think we have three first and two seconds next year.

Speaker 5: Yeah. So, like, there's a lot of capital where it's just like, hey. This is a great building block. We can build around this on defense. That's our spark plug. Maybe we get a little aggressive and move up from 16 because I often think that, you know, moving up from 16 to, let's say, seven or eight in getting in position to take Carnell Tate, Mekhi Lemmon if they're there. I don't think both of those guys are gonna fall to 16. So I I think the Jets will get a little aggressive with 16, take their pass rusher, and get aggressive and go get that wide receiver. That's what I personally think. I just I could be

Speaker 6: wrong. So question. I I get all that. Like, to to me, it would make sense for them to do that, to be aggressive and come up for a player like like, carnality. I'll and I really dig Mckay Lemon's game too. Like, to me, he looks to me like I can't not see Golden Tate when I see him play. I just it's just like, that's Golden Tate. And in today's game, that's a potential monster. Right?

Speaker 5: Yeah.

Speaker 6: But you have three first round picks next year. You have Jeremiah Smith. You have Cam Coleman. You have Ryan Williams. You have, you know, potential others that are gonna be in the draft next year. Why are you giving away future stuff to come up and take, no offense, Carnell Tate when when you could just sit there and go grab Jeremiah Smith or one of those other guys next year? Like, why would you do that? So to me, if you're making a if they're making a move from, say, 16 to seven, is that what we said? 16 to six, whatever it is? I I think it's for one of these corners. That now look at what think about Aaron Glenn's desire to have the physical imposing dude.

Speaker 5: Yeah.

Speaker 6: And then then think about Mansour Delaine with Aaron Glenn. Like, to me, that like, if you go David Bailey at two and then you come up to seven for for, Mansoor Delaine, I think you've crushed the first round. Yeah. Just crushed it. Even if I don't like David Bailey as a run defender at all. Right? And we don't. But it's like, to me, that's that's more of what I think what could be happening there, but this all started with with the whole Dallas thing. And I and I do think that there's some smoke to there's more than smoke to what Dallas has going on.

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Speaker 6: I just don't know if it's for styles or downs just yet. I don't know.

Speaker 5: Well, how about this? And I I don't know if enough people have talked about this because I don't think in in anybody's mind, it's it's reality. But I think it it could happen. And I could be wrong because we don't know what Arizona is gonna do at three. I I think they're super intriguing. So I'm gonna go kinda two ways here, and I'm gonna bring up two essentially, two different conversations at the same time. So Arizona at three. Monte Ozenfort, their their general manager, he has never stayed put. He always moves. I mean, he did it a few years ago. He doubled down. He went from three to six and then six to 12. That allowed the lions to or not from six to 12. He went from three to 12 and then back up to six. That allowed the Houston Texans to get Will Anderson and CJ Stroud. That allowed the Lions to get Jameer Gibbs and that allowed Arizona to get Paris Johnson. Yeah. And and we see it time and time again, draft day trades with him where he gets aggressive and he wants to move around. If David Bailey goes or Arvel Rees goes and that's their guy, who's to say that they don't move out of three? And again, maybe maybe that is where the Jets move up to. Maybe that is where Dallas moves up to. But if that is the case and just using this hypothetical, let's just say they stay put. Maybe they go, you know, offensive tackle, they take, Francis Maui Noah, and and they move on at three with the with the right tackle.

Speaker 6: How did the g become an n suddenly? What happened?

Speaker 5: Don't know. I'm just throwing I'm just throwing random letters together and praying for the best. No.

Speaker 6: I'm not saying you're saying it wrong, everybody. You got it right. But, like, I don't know what happened there, but that's a whole other. Sorry.

Speaker 5: You're good. But then, like, at four, you've got Tennessee. Let's say they go Jeremiah Love and then we're talking about, you know, five with the Giants, Sonny Styles, or Caleb Downs. That would put Arvel Rees right there in the lap at six. And we talked about Micah Parsons as a potential comp for him. Like, I think it just gets really interesting where it I mean, it could very well go Arvel reset six to Dallas and and I don't know. I I just think it's I think that's super intriguing and I think it's good to think of it from a different lens because we always talk about everything in the same kind of way. Everybody views everything the same way and then we get to the draft and we're like, oh, this is bonkers, which is why we all love it. But if you don't think with that open mind, like, I mean, like, for example, the

Speaker 6: growth Totally. And and I think that what you just said is a much more likely outcome than what everybody is currently projecting.

Speaker 1: Yeah.

Speaker 6: I do. And maybe Arizona can't trade. I'm I'm sure they want they would love to trade out. But is somebody really come I mean, who would they if it's Reese who falls to three and they don't take him, and I I really think that they need a right tackle desperately, like, who's gonna take Reese? Because it seems like Tennessee's pretty locked in with with Jeremiah Love, which I would totally understand because you need you need you need some you need some help for for your quarterback. Right? I kinda think that John Harbaugh needs that safety sort of chess piece kind of player. That's why I would think that Downes is more of a surefire surefire is not the right words. Downes is a much more likely player at five than I think people think. Now does that mean he's better than a 50 chance? I don't know. Who knows? But I think that I do think that the Giants are are are really trying to figure out between him between he and Sonny Styles, you know, like, which one. Right? So but if the Cardinals so that's the thing. Like, what if the Cardinals do something crazy? And that's they're they're holding the keys for the whole thing. Like, this year they take Maui Maui Noah or whatever. If they take him, then it it's sort of alright. Somebody's available at six that you just didn't think was gonna be.

Speaker 5: Yeah. No. I At

Speaker 6: least for me. Right? Maybe maybe everybody out there thought down thought thought downs would be and so be it. That's fine. I mean, we are talking about potentially two off ball linebackers and a safety in the top six and a running back. Like And a running back.

Speaker 5: The Lions changed the game, dude. Lions changed the game, and people are mad at, Brad Holmes for that. But, no, I'm with you. And I think like and and that's why I say potentially Arval Reese not being the guy at three because it kind of feels like that's what the Cardinals have been swinging for over the last several years. They took Xavion Collins, they brought in Isaiah Simmon I mean, they took Isaiah Simmons. Like, they've tried to get these chess piece players and it hasn't worked out. Maybe it does with Mike LaFleur there, but I I don't know. I mean, like, I I feel like going with Arval Reese, it's just kind of the same thing that they've already done. Now I think it could I think it could work for them.

Speaker 6: Flip the coin. Yeah.

Speaker 5: Right. But I just I mean and, like, are are they the team that potentially pivots and goes Jeremiah Love or Carmel Tate? I just I think Arizona is super intriguing. They just recently, you know, today, I think on on the last visit day as we record here on a Wednesday afternoon, they ended up visiting with Ty Simpson. So I don't think that's the pick at three, but as I said, Monte Ozenfort has never stayed put. So he might get a little intrigued to move up from, let's say, that second round and get into the back half of the first round and get his guy and Ty Simpson. So could this be the draft where they go receiver at three and then quarterback at, let's say, like, 26 or 27 or 28 or something like that? I I think it's very possible. So I do too. I don't know. We're we're gonna really see, obviously, how it all goes, at the top of the draft. Some other rumors we'll get into Lions rumors, but some other rumors that I have essentially heard, you know, staying with the Browns. Monroe Freeling is obviously kinda like the apple to the eye for them. That's the, I think, like, the the the pride the the the prize, the drool, the gem, the I'm stumbling all

Speaker 6: the We need to create we need to make an AI bong video for Munro Freeling. We do we do, You and I. Alright.

Speaker 5: We could probably do that in about thirty minutes or so. I don't know how to do it, but we can figure it out. But in a perfect world, yeah, we would love him at 17, but we've said it for months. And we've we've talked about him. If you're reading stuff today and going, wow, I can't believe this guy's gonna go top 15. Like, well, welcome to the Detroit Lions podcast because we've been talking about him since January, the very first week of January. And I I've been saying Cleveland at six since Mach one point o after the Super Bowl. Yeah. So I, like, I could see a scenario where Dallas would like to get up to six, but they don't and Cleveland stays and Monroe Freeling is the pick at six. I could really I could really see that. I could see Dallas moving up to, you know, eight or something like that instead of six. But, I I think Monroe Freeling is super intriguing. But the the player that, offensive tackle wise, and I wanted to mention away from Freeling to the Browns was Spencer Fanu. I I really struggle with where he lands because I know, like, everybody is like, oh, well, worst case scenario, Freeling and Procter are gone. We can take Spencer Fanu because Francis Maui No is gone, you know, the the the guard is gone. The the the players are gone. But if that if that were the case, like, Spencer Fanu could go to Miami at eleven. He could go to Baltimore at fourteen. I I think that those are the two. Yeah. I think I think specifically Houston and Miami or Houston, Baltimore and Miami. Those are the two teams that I just when I look at Fanu, I'm like, he's going to one of those two teams. I just feel like there's been a lot of a lot of tea leaves and things that point in the direction of them having strong interest in Fanu. And I just have a hard time believing that a guy that was in the summer this past year was a top five pick projected. He's been the number one tackle essentially when talking to scouts the last two years. I have a hard time believing that that guy falls on the top 15. I I really have a hard time believing that. I just I think he goes somewhere in that top 15 and Chiefs very well could be the sneaky sleeper pick. You'd be you'd fit like a glove there. With the amount of zone running that they do, he would fit like a glove. But Yeah.

Speaker 6: For sure. And I I mean, I think that's the point is that, I don't know if he is a, you know, a a hand in the glove match for what the lions want to do on their offensive line. Right? Like, they're gonna do a lot of pulling. They're gonna do they wanna they wanna displace bodies. Yeah. I don't think he's a perfect fit there. Right? And I I you know, just being completely upfront and honest with people, for me, if an offensive tackle doesn't want to use their hands all that well, it's something that I that I just go, I don't know how you fix that. I don't know how you, like sure. It gets better and and players get stronger and all those things. But if you don't punch, if you don't use your hands, and there are like, you just watch him watch him on film. He moves his feet great. There's there are no issues with the way he moves. It's ridiculous. But, like, he'll take his he wants to set his chin on on an edge rusher's, like, inside shoulder pad, and just kind of, like, ride them, you know, out of the pocket that way. It's so there's not a lot of control happening. It's more it's more finesse pass pro kinda stuff. Mhmm. He's got a I'm sure there are multiple homes in the NFL where he he could be really, really good. I just don't think he's a a great match for the Lions, and I I can be completely wrong. Right? Like, I could I'm wrong about all kinds of stuff all the time. You know? But I I am I he's one of those guys where I'm super curious where he lands. But that you know, I'll say the same thing about, like, about Blake Miller. There are times where I where I I watch him and I don't think he's I think he started 54 games for Clemson.

Speaker 5: Yep.

Speaker 6: And I don't think he uses his hands great either. Like, there are moments watching him run block where it's like a it's a down block where he's blocked they're on the goal line. It's let's say second or third in one. And his his job is to block and displace the three tech, and his hands kinda his hand his hands start out wide, and they just kinda grab on to the outside of it. Now this is in in run blocking stuff. Like

Speaker 5: Yeah. Oh, yeah.

Speaker 6: You know, we're grabbing, like, it's almost like we're chest blocking or we're hugging kind of thing.

Speaker 5: Mhmm.

Speaker 6: I don't know how you you resolve those things. So I see that kind of stuff, but it just it it gives me a little pause, but I also recognize fully that I don't have the answers for any of these things. And Mike Miller's a a high end prospect, Fanon's a high end prospect. Caleb Lomu is another one where I don't think he uses his hands great. But, like, if we if you're drafting for players for what they're going to be, maybe they think they can resolve some of those things. But, you know, it it'll be really interesting to see how, you know, you're you're talking about Cleveland at six, sort of setting the the tone for how the tackle class goes, and they really could. They really could. And, you know, think about the worst case scenarios. Let's say let's say there's no trade and Cleveland sits there and takes Freeling, and Kansas City takes Fanon at nine, and Miami takes a tackle at eleven, and Baltimore takes one at fourteen.

Speaker 5: Right.

Speaker 6: And you go, well, shit. You know, all the ones that you thought they might be able to choose from at seventeen, have there's been a run on those guys?

Speaker 5: Yeah. The list goes from this to that real fast. Much. Yeah. I mean, it it it shrinks up really fast and

Speaker 6: Yeah. Yeah. For sure.

Speaker 5: I I do I'm glad you mentioned Blake Miller because I I think next week, we'll try to do a a live show and probably finalize some draft picks and and those types of things. But,

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Speaker 5: I feel like Blake Miller could just be the guy for the lions. Like, he a 100% screams Detroit. 54 game starter, plays right tackle, effective run blocker. He looks to finish, strong hands, a guy that's got clean character Yeah. Praised for how he carries himself. Like, he just screams Detroit. And I feel like if that was the case, I'd I would be okay with it, especially to your point if the run of those tackles start at six or even three. Francis Maui Noah goes and then Monroe Freeling and then Fano and Proctor or or whatever the case may be. So I think it's it's really interesting on on how the tackles will shape up. I still lean towards offensive tackle. I I I'll let you think on this as far as, like, a potential. What would be the wild card? You know, obviously, Jermaine McCoy and we'll talk about him. But, like, what would be the wild card away from from defensive end and and offensive tackle that would essentially surprise you a little bit with Detroit that maybe you didn't see happening, and you can you can think and ponder that. But one of the

Speaker 6: It's go ahead. Go. No.

Speaker 1: Go no. Go ahead. Go ahead.

Speaker 6: I to me, it's Guard. Are are you taking, Vega Yowane? Iowane? However no offense. I don't know how to say your last name, which is ridiculous. I've said it a million times, a million times the wrong way. I can you can you can create I mean, you can you can weave a story around his game where he makes more sense in some ways than bolstering the interior might make more sense for Jared Goff than taking an edge a tackle. It just might. You're right. And then and then I think about what that would do for the ground game and all those things, and I he he would be super intriguing. But outside of after guard, the surprise picks would be corner and and safety. Like, it's the safety thing is, like, we don't we don't totally know what's happening there. Yeah. We feel we both feel pretty good about what their corner room looks like for this year. But after this year, you know, you're talking about you're talking about Terry and Arnold being in year going after this year's so this year's gonna be year three for him. So after this year, you're it's year four for him. I think it's the I think DJ Reed has two years left on his deal realistically, where it's also gonna be possibly the end of of DJ Reed's deal here. We don't know what's happening with Rake Straw. There's no idea. Rakya Sen's here for one year. Roger McCreary is here for one year. So I just think people need to be it needs to be on the radar that while the room the the corner room looks to be, like, okay for the 2026 season, you could you could see how they might think that it's not so set for beyond that. Yeah. And then you go, alright. I don't think Mansour Delaine will be there. I don't think there's really any hope that he's there at 17.

Speaker 5: Right.

Speaker 6: But we do need to talk about Tennessee's Jermaine McCoy, and I don't wanna do this because because he scares me.

Speaker 5: Yeah.

Speaker 6: But I think we need to kinda pivot to, is this would this be a surprise pick for Brad Holmes to make?

Speaker 5: Yeah. And that and that's the the the the recent lion's rumor. There's essentially two. Before we get into it, I will say the surprise pick for me would be Dylan Thieneman. I've said that time and time again. I think he screams Detroit lion. You think of, like, Dan Jackson. I think Dylan Thieneman is a more athletic, bigger version of Dan Jackson essentially, and and certainly a better athlete for sure and just one of those guys that I I could see the Lions meeting with Thieneman at the combine and just falling in love. I could just see it all day long. And the other player real quick, we haven't talked about him, and we haven't talked about the rumor or the the confirmed accident. But Miami, Florida, Reuben Bain junior, he had the car accident from 2024. That was reported by Ollie Conley, over the weekend, and, this is something that's been really well known. Brad Holmes kinda touched on it in the press conference. I know Jeff Rizdon did a good job breaking it down here on the Detroit Lions podcast earlier in the week, which, by the way, be sure to rate, review, and subscribe to the Detroit Lions podcast on YouTube, Apple Podcast, Spotify, and all other podcast platforms. But, I don't think Rubin Bain would even be on the lion's radar after knowing this incident, to be completely honest with you. I think it's very similar in a sense of, like, Jalen Carter. And and, you know, I'm not saying Ruben Bane is a bad guy. I'm not saying Jalen Carter is a bad guy. Yeah. But these red flags, I think, are something that if the lions know about it ahead of time, they're gonna flag it and they're not gonna even try to work with it, ahead of time. If they're in house, they're gonna try their best to make it work, which is what they did with, like, guys like Jameson Williams. And, obviously, I think we're seeing that a little bit with Terry and Arnold. But the Ruben Bayne stuff's super interesting. I think he's obviously a big domino in how he could affect the top 15, certainly the top 17 of this draft, but I still think he's a first round pick. I don't think this is something that is gonna change anything, with his draft status or anything like that. So we'll get into McCoy here in a minute, but just wanted to touch on Bane real quick. Do you feel that same way with Ruben Bane?

Speaker 6: I I do, and it's a bummer because I love his game, and and it's he would just be like, wow, man. Like, the run defense, the physicality, I I I mean, I just I know he's got short arms, and that's gonna that's the knock, on him, but the way he plays and as violent as he is with his with his hands and his shoulders and, his relentlessness and all that stuff. And to me, the the wider you line him, the wider his alignment, the better he becomes because he's just so, the twitch in his hands is just it's just crazy to watch. Right? But it's it's hard to see that it's hard to see the the lions, these guys, these decision makers being cool with the and there's some of it for us is or at least I'll speak for myself. I don't fully know all of everything that went on there. It just seems to me like there's enough there, and there's enough there's some stuff around his arm length where you go, alright. Is this accident thing something that teams can now put on paper and say, yeah. He wasn't necessarily a player that we were really looking at because of x when when, truthfully, maybe they were they were a little worried all along because of the stature stuff. I don't know. I love his game. I think he's I think he's one of this draft's best players. So it's it's complicated. You know, I I it's I'm sure there are teams that are that are not considering drafting him at this point, which is a bummer.

Speaker 5: Yeah. No. A 100%. And I I think teams had that mindset going into this process. Like, they've known about the short arms for a while. Going into this draft cycle, it was reported from Dane Brugger that scouts believe Ruben Bane is more of a second round pick. So I I think, you know, it'll be interesting where he lands. I again, I still think first round, you still think first round, it's just a matter of kinda when and where Yeah. He ends up going. And being available by pick 17. Like, even the Rams at 13. I've talked about this. I've joked about it. Like, the league's gonna let the Rams get Reuben Bain. They don't really need them.

Speaker 6: Nope. Nope. Nope. Nope. Nope.

Speaker 5: But I could see it. I could totally see that in a week. You know? I could totally see that. So, obviously, we'll see what happens with Ruben Bane. I think Kansas City would obviously make a lot of sense, and I think there's other teams too. I think Washington would make some sense for him. I think Dallas would make sense for him. But, I don't know if Dallas would move up think they might wait and see if he falls to him at twelve if that were the case. But Yeah.

Speaker 6: I mean, it's for the the the final thing for me with Bane is, like, it's hard for me to watch Bane and and for for me to think that, alright, there's there are, you know, a bunch of teams in the NFL that are gonna let that guy go because of his arm length. Have you watched? Yeah. Right? Like, he's he's awesome. Right? Yeah.

Speaker 5: But Yeah.

Speaker 6: There's there's enough out there there's enough out there around the stuff that's going on to make me think that for reasons you you you listed around, some of the character things that the lions are pretty serious about, or at least have been in the past for me to think that he's not necessarily a a player that they they would target.

Speaker 5: Yeah. Yeah. No. We're we'll see. I mean Yeah. It's it's really it's obviously the whole incident is unfortunate. Yeah. It it's it is a bummer. But, hopefully, it's it's one of those things that, you know, he's learned from. Hopefully, it's something that, everything sorts out and everything's good in the long run, and all of that. But, one other rumor and and to kinda tie it all in together, lions were rumored on social media. And, again, you take it for for what it's worth. But, there the rumor was that they would be linked to a big bodied player. They're gonna get a bigger player with their first pick. And that got social media kind of in a buzz of, like, hey. They're gonna take Caden Proctor from Alabama. They're gonna take Caden McDonald, the defensive tackle from Ohio State. Lions being linked to Tennessee corner Jermaine McCoy. So obviously, McCoy is not a very big player. He's he's not a small player, but he's not a very big player. He's not an offensive lineman or defensive lineman. So I think it's really interesting. I mean, I guess I I guess essentially take your pick. Would you rather have Caden Proctor, Caden McDonald, or, Jermaine McCoy on draft day if if the rumors are true? I know that's a tough one. I know that's a tough one. Those are the three worst options.

Speaker 6: The problem is is that we have no idea what his knee looks like. I know he ran. He he tested. He ran his 40 and it was good. But from what I understand, his the positional drills were not great. And it's hard so it's hard to totally know this information, but I had heard that he didn't run the positional drills at full speed. Don't know whether that's true or not. Right? So but the problem is is that you have a a guy who tore his ACL in January of of two thousand twenty five after putting out a year of what I would consider to be pretty elite film. Like, his his film his tape from from the '20 from that from that season, the like, the twenty twenty four twenty twenty five season of him at Tennessee is pretty awesome.

Speaker 5: Mhmm.

Speaker 6: Specifically, you could watch it's it's fun. You can watch him play up against Ryan Williams from Alabama. And Ryan Williams is fast fast. Oh, yeah. And McCoy's fine in that matchup. Totally fine. You then get to you can then watch him play against Ohio State, and you can see him run and play in coverage with Carnell Tate, and you could see him run and play in in coverage with Jeremiah Smith. Smith does get him on a touchdown on a on, like, a slot fade kind of play. But for the most part, McCoy does not look like, a, he he really gets beat by by guys who we that we know are pretty fast.

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Speaker 6: And the second part is, like, he just seems totally unfazed by it. Like, dude, they're about to snap the ball. Like, stop talking to your safety and and you know what I mean? Like, so he's just he's one of those guys where you, you know, he's fast. He's twitchy. To me, he's smart. There's a play he makes against Alabama where there are he's he's on the outside, and, the slot receiver ends up getting a I think it might even be Ryan Williams. I'm not sure who whoever it is for, for Alabama catches a a pass over the middle, and he and he snaps off of his coverage because he sees this all happening. And he gets to the middle of a field quick enough that he drills the receiver in the back and breaks up a pass. And it's like, well, it's impressive. And then there's some stuff where you see the click and close, just how just how efficient and good it looks. And I and I go, alright. As the film is is high end, right, where you would say, I don't we don't have an answer for this, but where would he have gone in last year's draft after looking the way he did last year? And if he doesn't suffer the ACL injury and he puts together another season like he looked like 2024, '25, if he looked like that again, I think we are talking about him being the number one corner in this class. I do. I know that's a whole bunch of what ifs. Like, you know, if

Speaker 5: Yeah. No. But he would have been he he would have been after Travis Hunter last year, but he would have gone in front of John a Baron probably.

Speaker 6: Hell, yeah. He

Speaker 5: he would have been a top 15 pick. Like, just looking back at that draft, like, I know they took Tyler Warren, but he would scream Indianapolis Colt to me at, like, 13 or 14 whenever they took Tyler Warren. So, like, I'm with you. I think McCoy a year ago, we're talking about him in a different in a different lens. But with the injury, it's it's kinda scary. And before everybody gets mad and starts yelling at Scott in the comments about Ryan's and all this stuff, and he's not fast, just for everybody that knows, just went went and checked my notes as I go to my twenty twenty seven draft tab. Ryan Williams, ten fifty five. Ten second 10.55, seconds in the 100 meter dash outdoors, as, like, a 16 year old. So Yeah.

Speaker 6: He's fast fast. He's like yes. Absurd. Yeah.

Speaker 5: Absurd fast. And if you're like, oh, he sucks, I I suggest watching Alabama. I know it's a bit of an off year last year, but he's still very good. And Jermaine McCoy, I wouldn't be I wouldn't be happy with it because I just I I've said this time and time again, if they walk out of this draft in the first round on Thursday night without an offensive tackle, I'm gonna be pissed. I would still be kinda pissed, but I guess I would have to see what the offensive tackle room looks like

Speaker 6: Yeah.

Speaker 5: Going into day two. Like, what what's what's it going to look like? And at the same time, like, I still could see a scenario where the Lions move up. Right? Like, could they get to 32? Could they get from 50 to 32? Yeah. Trade the farm, get your corner, get an offensive tackle, maybe you go McCoy and then Blake Miller. I I don't know. I I don't know what offensive tackle is gonna be there. I again, I think the run is gonna happen. And by the time you get to pick 28 or 29, six or seven of those guys are gonna be off the board at offensive tackle. I genuinely believe that. So

Speaker 6: I do too. And I so, I mean, back to McCoy for a second is, the risk it brings.

Speaker 5: Yeah.

Speaker 6: Right? Like, we're talking some of this is probably a little hyperbole at this point, but some of it is is also fact. He was he wasn't quite ready to participate at the combine. We're talking we're talking at that point I wanna say that was thirteen or so months post post injury. And if we are to if we are to believe that he that he had just gotten ready for his pro day to run the 40, but wasn't totally available due to to do position drills at full speed. Like, we're talking about a long recovery time. And

Speaker 5: Oh, yeah.

Speaker 6: Right? So so even if even if, you know, we even if we just kinda sweep that stuff under the rug, it's still a long time to to to be dealing with recovering from an injury. And it's it just leads to, like, for me, it leads to questions about what's you know, what is his long term prognosis? What is what's in the short term for him? Why would, why are we bringing on such risk? And I know that Brad Holmes in the past has done the, you know, hey, we're getting value because this player is a little hurt. And if he wasn't hurt, he would, you know, he would have gone a full round fuller than where we're getting him. But you're taking a player, you're taking a player at 17. So are you really getting much, are you really getting value? Now they might think that if they have, like, a top five grade on him. I would totally get it. And I and I would understand, like, alright. You are getting value because he you know, what you if you're thinking he is the number one corner in this class, if he's healthy, I'm all in. That's great. Do that. You know, for reasons that I said earlier, I I think that there is a little, you know, there is a a low key need long term in the corner room, but it's just about the amount of risk that that move carries. And are they really willing to do that? And I don't know. I have no idea. What do you I mean, do you think there's as much risk as as me? I mean, am I am I

Speaker 5: No. You're right. I think there's a ton of risk. I I whenever I say this all the time, specifically with corners. When they get a lower body ailment injury, I'm running. I'm running for the hills because you have one, it's coming back. When you have those players same thing with Jordan Tyson. I am terrified of him in round one. I get how good he is and how good he can be, but we're talking about a player that has not been healthy since 2022. If the Lions take McCoy at 17, we could get to 2028 and 2029 and have that same conversation. Be like, this guy hasn't been healthy since 2024. We're doing it right now with Ennis Rakeshtra. You know what I'm saying? So Uh-huh. That's where I struggle with everything. Yeah. I the mindset of it, I put everything together, connecting dots, it makes sense. It makes a 100% sense if that's the guy that they like. And at the same time, is it is it McCoy that they're after or is it his teammate, Colton Hood? You know what I mean? Is that the guy that they want? Because he also fits. He's a press man corner. He's physical as hell. Yeah. So maybe they brought in McCoy to get a little bit of details on Colton Hood. And they're they're they're playing the game. They're playing the system. We'll see. But I think it's gonna be really interesting. One last rumor as we kinda close-up shop, and it's it's nothing too crazy, aside from Jermaine McCoy. Have we given any thought of the lines trading up from 17? And if so, is there a specific player that would make sense? I think it would probably be a delay. I think it would be a Caleb Downs, or I think it would it would have to be probably one of these pass rushers, but we've kind of said that it wouldn't be Ruben Bain. So maybe maybe it's an offensive tackle? Would it be an off would you be okay with them trading up for an offensive tackle like a Monroe Freeling going up and getting your left tackle?

Speaker 6: Yeah. Depending on what it would cost them. Yeah. I would. I I'd be you know? If it's if it's delaying, yes, please. If it's if it's downs, uh-huh. Like, absolutely. And if it's a if it's a player that I think if it obviously, if they're doing that, just to the tackle concept. If it's a player they're moving up for, there's there's some certainty in knowing that the Lions feel comfortable both in the short term and the long term that it was worth going to get him. So yes. Yes. By all means. They're in they're in a position at pick 17 where they're looking at they're on the outside looking in at what I would consider to be the first round graded player. I don't know how many how how many you have, but it seems like from, you know, all the the national people, like, maybe it's 12 to 13 range, maybe 14 max, first round of graded players. So if you do need if you do need to move up a little bit to secure one of those guys, I don't I don't think that's a bad move in the long term. And it just it depends on the the cost. Like, does it cost pick 50 to do that? Right. And if so, are are Lions fans and us, are we are we are you comfortable having one pick in the first three rounds in this draft? It's not the great it's not a great scenario, but as long as that player pans out if that player pans out to be a a high level, really good player, I don't think in the long term people are gonna care too much. Right? But but it sure would I I wouldn't wanna be part of, I'm gonna log off for for a day

Speaker 5: if that happens. Yeah. Yeah. Well, I I I just hope for my sanity on Thursday night, I don't have to sit and clip up defensive back tape all night long. I would much rather watch the trenches. It's so much more enjoyable for me. Yeah. I'll I just like the physical element. So I, yeah, I would love to just see them go in the trenches. I think trading up is certainly an option. I know I know Brad, and we've talked about this a lot. Brad always uses the word conviction. If they have conviction, they got a guy that they really like and it's a good football player. They're gonna go get him. It just it is what it is. So Yeah. We'll we'll obviously see how it turns out next week. I think, I think next week, we'll try to do, like, a live NFL draft q and a for people. They can chime in. They can roast us. They can do whatever. We'll have some fun with it a night before the draft. And then, obviously, I think, we'll be doing some live draft coverage on the Detroit lines podcast with with Chris, Jeff, yourself, whoever. So it should it should be a lot of fun, but I don't I don't have anything else. I think we could spin in circles and go over every single option, but if if you want more, you wanna know a position group, you wanna you you wanna talk about a key message or go find the Ed rusher episode we did, you can go back and find those, on the Detroit Lions podcast. As I said earlier, rate review and subscribe to the Detroit Lions podcast on YouTube, Apple Podcast, Spotify, and all other, podcast platforms. Do you have anything else, Scott?

Speaker 6: No. I think we've we've, we've talked enough about about uncertain things that we don't know about.

Speaker 5: Yeah. Nope. And, we'll continue to not know about them, but we will, do our best to try to figure it out and connect the dots, as we move along. If you want more, find us on x or Twitter at Russ NFL Draft and at Bischoff underscore Scott. Been a lot of fun. We'll do an NFL Draft q and a next week. We'll we'll definitely do that. He's Scott Bischoff. I'm Russ Brown. This has been Bischoff and Brown right here on the Detroit Lions podcast.